The "Berman Method" with Lisa Berman

All right, welcome back to the Future of Fitness podcast. I'm your host, Eric Malzone, and this is episode number 35. I get to talk to Lisa Berman. She is a what I would classify as a master trainer out of Corona Del Mar, California. And she really embodies what this whole show and this whole movement is about. She's been a one-on-one trainer for a very long time. She has a very busy week. She uh trains up to 30 people per week. She has a strong referral network, but she feels the need now to take her business online and take it to the next level. And that's the process that she's going through now. And she's developing the Berman method. So the Berman method essentially stands on three pillars mind, structure, and energy. And she'll tell you all about it and how she's doing it. And it's really interesting. And anytime I get to talk to somebody who has this much experience, uh, you know, spent this much time in the trenches, there's always nuggets that I get to pull out of it. And one of my favorite ones from this one was when she said, Don't build your days around fear. I was like, Whoa, that's great. And what does it mean? Well, in this reference, in this context, it means don't try to grab all the clients, right? Do the grab the clients that you know you should be working with that you can do the most good for, and then refer the other ones to people who are better fit. And I think that's really why she has this very, very strong referral network. She doesn't do any marketing. So yeah, without further ado, uh listen to this. It's Lisa Berman, she's great, and I hope you enjoy it. Everybody, welcome back. It's Eric with the Future of Fitness podcast, and today I have Lisa Berman. Welcome on the show, Lisa.

Hi, thank you.

So I uh you and I had a good chance to talk before this, and I think uh people understand what you're doing now. I think it's it would be really interesting for people to know kind of what your path has been to get there and all the pieces that are now formed what what you're up to now with the Berman method and uh and your new direction. So give us a brief history of both of where you've come from and where you are now.

So I've always been a physical person. Um, I've always been a hands-on person. Um as a girl, I was a dancer who um had orthopedic uh problems, and so I would say by the time I was 10, I was struggling with not dislocating. So I I ended up by age 13 having the first of four reconstructive knee surgeries. Um, that made me really um have a love of orthopedics, and uh I learned that kinesiology was a real thing. And um, like really that's a whole thing, just studying movement. That's awesome. And uh I thought I wanted to be an orthopedic surgeon, and so I thought high school job, senior year, perfect thing, work in a gym, and then a real trainer walked in and I realized wait a minute, this is a real job, like I can help people be fit and they don't have to be hurt first, and I can help them not get hurt. And so that's where being a trainer started for me. Um, then so I was first certified by the American Council on Exercise in 1991. Um, people asked me, How did you how did you become a trainer? Like how do you that's a real job? It was it was kind of a Hollywood thing then. So people asked, and um a partner and I put together a training course to help people, it was like a six-month thing to help people get certified. And then we hired the diamonds in in our classes and um signed my first corporate lease at age 20, where we did our training. Yeah, I was just ignorantly an ignorant entrepreneur, just following passion. And um so that's where we did our trainings, and then we did some life and career management trainings, but back then the gyms didn't know like that this was a money-making thing, and to start charging trainers or in-housing them, and so we had agreements with clubs from Venice to San Clemente along the coast, and put our trainers in those facilities, and that's kind of how I started my first uh fitness business, and that was 1991, and I've been riding the waves since very hands-on trainer. So um, stretching, I've been doing that for 28 years, stretching people and myofascial work. Um, the acupuncture or acupressure is something I've studied to a great extent. I would say my intuition guides my curiosity for science, and they just kind of go together. So now I'm here. Um, I have a studio that I'm rebranding painfully. Um, and in Corona del Mar, California, and it looks like a Pilates and Bodywork studio.

Cool. Yeah, there's something interesting in what you said is you know, you're intuitive, but you're also science-based, right? Yeah, that's that's an interesting combination, right? Explain to us a little bit more about how you meld those two, how you kind of use what you're innately feeling and seeing, and then combining that with science and how that works for you.

Yeah, so um, I at a very young age when I started working with people, I saw and knew things that were beyond my scope of knowledge, which I think that a lot of good trainers do. Like a young trainer just feels this passion and this fire inside and this drive to learn because they get it. And one of my teachers, one of my energy, it was um uh like an energy system that I studied early on. She said to me, the things that you will take from me into your work are will feel like the things that you already knew. And so yet it was very technical. It wasn't, it wasn't ha-hoo-y stuff. It was like, it was the the meridians in the body and deep subsets of the meridians. But you know, you either get that stuff or you don't get that stuff, but it's not, it's not woo-woo, it's it's measurable, it's what um acupuncturists work on, it's you know, measurable by bioelectrical impedance. So the energy in our bodies aren't woo-woo. And some of us are just a little bit more in touch with it, but it wasn't okay with me that I somehow just knew things that I couldn't explain. So that's what kind of drove my passion to continue studying. And then um, I thought I was going to the Rolfe Institute because I won't, I became, you know, I'm very biomechanical and very structural, and I thought that's where I was going. And my roller directed me to Pilates in 1996, where I studied under Rayla Sakowitz, which was a really blessing in disguise that that's who I landed with and uh studied all the way through, you know, everything I can with him and still do his uh master reunion every year. And then I went to massage school. So now I'm studying Z Health for functional neurology. So it's kind of just always following the curve and trying to explain and keep keep knowledge for Yeah.

So what is that? What is Z Health and and um functional neurology? That's uh something that you know I'm I haven't been fully engaged with, and I'd like to know more because maybe it's uh something that I know a little bit of and I've never put it all together, you know. So how give us give us some in-depth on that.

So I learned about Z Health through um Leslie Cordova, um, who I used to room with at conferences and stuff. And and Z Health stands for um the Z is half of the double helix of the DNA chain. And so Dr. Cobb, that's his company, it's zhealth.net. And um he is chiropractor by trade, but he practices not as you know, adjusting bones. Um and it's basically um like in in uh in anatomy, we learned the humunculus monkey is, you know, if if you've heard of that, um it's our proprioceptive map that gets messed up when anything, anything in our body that's that's stuck or not moving well, it'll mess everything up. So it's like it's like traffic. If one road is one street on the on the um on the map is closed, there might be too much traffic on the next street. So like our brains work like that, our bodies work like that. So we have, you know, a frozen shoulder is gonna affect everything in our body, not just all of our other joints, but also you know, how our lungs function and and everything. So um V health, the the DNA chain, we're hearing more and more about neuroplasticity and that the body is our DNA can be changed. We can change it. So, and you know, as trainers, um, more and more we're getting into functional movement and studying like where is it not going well? So in Z Health, there's our phase is the rehabilitation. So they teach rehabilitation of movement at every joint, so there's a drill for every joint. Um, eye phase is to integrate the visual and vestibular system. The eyes and ears are like the compass on your dash that tells you, you know, what direction to go in. And if our eyes and ears are messed up, so is our our compass, our our sense of where we're going. Um and then S phase is is um is more sport movement. Uh, you learn a lot of like I remember learning bone rhythm, like everyone takes something different. Um, Dr. Cobbs is always saying in uh what's how's this gonna affect your Monday morning practice? So like everyone will take something different back to their studio. And so S phase for me was hugely about just seeing bone rhythm and um how people move and directional changing and stuff like that. And then T was um like tissue work and there, like more the therapeutic, which was very natural for me. Um, I'm currently in their master trainer program, which is really grueling. Um and it's just there's you know, burning the brain and how it works and and our nervous system um and movement. So, and that's where my method I'm working on on build um kind of I'm at a stage, I've been in the industry for a few minutes and I'm wanting to teach again. So I'm wanting to come come back around and teach. I always want to do my time in the trenches, and uh that's why Todd Durkin's a great mentor for me because it's one of the things that I love about him is he he stays practicing. So some of us like stop and teach. I'll always have my you know 15 to 20 sessions at least. Um, and you know, doing what I do, but I want to teach. So I'm branding, I'm modulizing my method, which is blending all those things.

Yeah, so is that 15 to 20 sessions per week or per per month?

Per week. Right now I'm at about 30. Okay, which is hard. Yeah, it's hard because I'm you know, I have this studio, I've been here um April 2018 will be two years. I've been in this new location. And you know, trying to build a team and onboard and hire or interview the whole interviewing and staffing. You see, I mean, it's never been this hard. So um, to be honest, it's been challenging. And I think just maybe I'm getting pickier. Um, maybe it's more personal to me. Cause I mean, I've always taken ownership, I believe, in every every management position I've had. But this is this is, I don't know, it's been challenging.

Yeah, yeah, it it it it it definitely can be. I think uh, you know, looking back on my career as a facility owner, if I was gonna do one thing more of as I would have um really invested more in in the people that I had hired and getting and really focusing on getting people in the right spot, right? That's that's a big challenge. I mean, there's a lot of opportunity, a lot of talent out there. It's just how do you bring them into and who's gonna be right for your system and what your vision is, and then um and making sure that they're doing the right things once you get them in. There's there's a lot of challenges there for sure. I'm curious because I never heard this. What is bone rhythm? What is that? Can you give us a practical example of what that is?

Like for one example, um, a squat, uh, the top of the femur should go back as much as the bottom of the femur goes forward.

Okay.

And so just watching that. And so if you if you look at a person doing a squat, yeah, you can go deeper, but it needs to be in a balance that you're not creating that pressure over the tibia. And you know, we know that in different ways, but when you start thinking of it like that in all of the body, you start to see, and then you start to see where people have structural tendencies that are just gonna be their thing they always have to work on, which becomes their stretching routine or you know, what they need to do when they feel this. And so, yeah, like somebody has a really long femur, but a lort uh um short torso. So, not holding Dr. Cobbs to my um my description of it because of course I take what I learned from him and putting my own, like how I use it. But yeah.

So you have, I mean, obviously you you put your time in the trenches, you're you're highly educated. Uh do you have like when you start off a new client, do you have an assessment system or is it something where you just start working with them and then you just intuitively see things and then a plan comes out of your head? Like how how do you systemize that or how does that work for you?

That's a great question. Um, I would say I started out being very uh like long time ago, really great systems, and I'm very stubborn to change them because they work so well. Um, I do have a very high referral network, but pretty much 98% of people that I meet with, I'm gonna work with. So, like, why would I mess with that welcome process and meeting people process? So I do have um, I'm stubborn, I guess this is what I'm getting at. I don't work with anybody before I spend an hour with them to see whether or not we want to work together. And I don't charge for that. So it's it's both of us investing our time and making sure that it's a fit. I'm dying at 30 sessions a week, and uh I'm grateful for that. I'm I'm very humbly grateful for that, but um, I protect my time and my studio. There's so many places and there's so many professionals out there, and probably why I'm mostly referral is I refer a lot. So I'm always looking and I don't want to just hog people up and have them not really be a fit for my space. I mean, I punch a hard day and I want to feel like when I look at that day, I'm like, all right, I can do that. You know, it's a lot of energy, it's a lot of focus, a lot has to go right and be organized. But um yeah, so that while that time that I spend with people getting to know them, um, you know, most of the time we end up working together. And then my next session is still not a workout. So it's where I'm struggling. Like we people really want to get moving. And so where I've switched that one up is it's a 90-minute session that we spend half on assessment and half I get them moving. I do some hands-on um stretching and working on them so that I can that's like still intake as I'm working on them and also um teaching. Like I feel like they don't have to be a trainer to learn about themselves. Like if they're if they know me for 10 sessions, I want to make sure when they leave, they leave with knowledge of themselves that they can take anywhere. So those first two sessions are me learning, them learning, seeing if it's a fit, and then starting to I start to get like mental visuals of their patterns and taking notes. I do have uh a process for taking notes. I do a little nutrition intake. Um that's the biggest thing I think I want to revamp and add more to. Like that's maybe where it needs to, I don't know. That's a tough one.

Yeah. You have uh the the most trainers have the issue of uh not being able to find clients to fill up their day, right? Yours is finding the right client, which I'm curious, was there a point in time, I'm sure when you were first getting started, you just took any client, right? Or was it always like that?

No, it was always like that. And I don't know, I don't know, and I would say to any trainers, like I think, or any person in any profession, that don't build your days out of fear or lack. Like if you really believe in what you're doing and you love it, um find other people who are good around you, have a referral network. Um, my first, I mean, because I had amazing like Fortune 500 clients at age 20, and they taught me a lot. And so I had this amazing board of directors that were, you know, I mean, I learned a lot, and and um you've got to follow that passion and you've got to build the clientele and the business that you want, and if you're really focused on that, I believe if your heart every day is in that spot and you wake up, um big part of that is don't assess it at night because you should go to bed on empty. And um, my friend Josh Bowen just wrote the book to the grave on empty. And um, I love that, and you should go to bed on empty and feel like I gave it all, and you you know what you need to do tomorrow, but you're excited about it, and um and uh you may not have the energy for it because you need to sleep well. But um that I think no, I ignorantly was passionate and led by great mentors. I would say I was very, very lucky early on to have great mentors that taught me about life and career management.

So that's huge. I I love that too, is don't plan things out of fear. That's a huge lesson. Um, I'm gonna like I'm gonna get that on my desktop. Um so we've been you mentioned something earlier before, how and it was a great, and I hope I get this right, but heal to be strong, strong to be powerful. So tell us what that means to you and how you incorporate it into your practice.

So one of the best trainers I ever worked with um was talking to me just like about like NASA's stuff, like basic, you know, like how to build strength. And it was like you have to heal and correct the pattern, and then you have to build strength on that if you want to then build power. And the thing is, people just want to be powerful. They come and can you make me powerful and pain-free? Well, there's some healing to do, and there's some strength to build on that, and then you know, power, and I think we're always in phases with that, but um I I think if anything, I was born to be, and I I have struggled to own this word because it sounds weird, but I was born a healer, and I meet people on a lot of different planes in a lot of different ways, and it's healing, and um and we get stronger together, and then all of a sudden they're they're feeling powerful, and then sometimes they come in. We've been like really working hard, but then they need some grace that day, you know, and it's okay. Or we really need to work on, oh my gosh, I noticed your ribs aren't moving the way they should. We need to work on some correction, uh, you know, and that's healing movement. Um so heal to be strong, strong to be powerful is my my threes.

Yeah, so I got it right. Okay, good. Yes. So tell me what's um what what's the future look like for you? What is what's the Berman method? How are um how are what what's your vision now? What are you what are you looking at?

Um I am feeling travel, which my coach in um in the Todd Dorking Mastermind, my coach Kelly Corcante, who I love, uh when I told her, I didn't ask her, I told her I was opening the studio. She's like, what? I could I could like this is gonna okay. And she knows if I say I'm gonna do something, I'm doing it. So um she's like, this could be a little snag in your getting the Berman method out there. And so I just had to do it. This is my home base, it's my lab. I need my people. I also need to, I need it as like proof. That's what I'm doing works. So I need to be teaching my people and it needs to be profitable and working. And so that's what I've been working on the last year and a quarter, year and a half. And um I see as soon as possible, I really want to get out there and teach. And um, and while I when I travel, I'll I'll book some special sessions with people that I'm meant to work with uh that need healing. So I'm excited about that. Traveling, teaching.

What do you think? Can you give us some insight on what your what your curriculum will look like? Like how what are all the the factors that you're gonna put into your your special sauce?

Um so mind. Uh one of the things about I call it personality postures. Um to me, people's personality or their history or their psychology is like a specialized um compensatory pattern to their structure. You know, like if they constantly like the way people lean in, the way people do things, or when they were hurt and something happened emotionally, I believe that that sits in the body. It goes with how we move. Um, sometimes those are our expressions that we must keep. They're like who we are, it's how we emote. We keep those, we celebrate those, we use those to inspire people. But the ones that are hurting us, we need to learn about. Um, the ones that are keeping us trapped, we need to learn about. So that's part of my mind. Uh it's kind of three, it's turning into three pillars. It was eight, but I've brought it into mind, structure, and energy. So the mind is that's just one look at also some NLP hypnosis, regression. I'm not trying to be a psychiatrist, I'm not trying to teach people to be. Um, and I have some pillars built in to keep that appropriate to our industry and our scope of practice. Um, structure is structure, and I've from being a trainer, um, somebody that has my orthopedic issues that's had to learn um to be strong physically, because I'm not, I'm not physically, I'm not born physically strong. Um, I've had to work at that and I have to work at it. Um so structure, taking it from like weight training, my dad was a bodybuilder, taught me. Um taking it from that to and ballet to Pilates to being a hands-on therapist, structure, um hugely, yeah. I've got that into pillars and and I think they're good. I'm excited to share them. Um, and then my earth energy is not the hoo-hoo-e like there is a spiritual element to it when we we uh meet people at all levels, but um it's the literal flow of energy, um, understanding that, and then how to make it flow better. So, and there's a lot of pillars built in all of that.

So yeah, that's a look at that and that's that's awesome. I mean, it's very unique um, you know, to most of the things I've at least come across and I've been exposed to. Uh, and it's it sounds really yeah, it just sounds interesting that you can really take a look at someone holistically and not just what you know what their back squat numbers are, right? And and take them and bring them along a journey. And I'm just curious, how long when you take on a client, um how long, what's that lifetime of a client with you? Is it months, years? Because I feel like uh people would probably stick with you for a pretty long time.

So my long my client who's been with me the longest, unless I'm forgetting somebody, is 17 years. Wow. Um and 10. I've got one that's moving. I've been with 10.

Okay.

So sad. You know, so yeah, people, I always say people don't leave if they do it with a break and they come back. Um, and again, I don't mean that I'm so blessed by that that that I get to be a part of people's lives and a part of their their their team, their coaching team, their medical team, their I always know my place and my scope of practice, but I get to be a part of all that and I get to know them better than their doctor, better than they know themselves. And and so people come back for that.

Oh, that's fantastic. Yeah, that's great. I mean, it's because when I when I hear you talk, I just think, wow, she has a lot to offer and she can most likely always be able to take someone to the next step, right? Like there's there's not like a hard point where you get to you like, okay, you're good, you're out of here. You know, there's always stuff to work on. So Lisa, where do people find you if they're interested in finding out, you know, or stay on top of what might happen with the Berman method in the next few months? How do they get a hold of you?

So my um under renovation website is there is there is something there, but um, I'm I will be renovating my website, W it's um bermanfitness.com.

Okay.

Email is Lisa at BermanFitness.com.

Awesome. That's B-E-R-M-A-N. Yes, thank you. Great. Well, Lisa, thank you so much. This was uh this was very educational for me, and I'm I'm excited to see what you come up with. And uh yeah, just keep up the great work. Thank you.

Thank you.

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