Mr. Mace Man - Rik Brown

I have a waiting list. What can I say? Okay, it doesn't make sense. When I found something that I would do whether I fail at it or not, whether a thousand people come into this business after me and do better than me, I'm still gonna do it. If I never ever have another seminar, never do another podcast, never do another magazine article, I'm still gonna be doing the mace. I will do it whether it works or not.

Hey fitness friends, welcome back to the Future of Fitness podcast and interview series. This is your host, Eric Malzone, and we are in episode number 92. I get to talk to Rick Brown, and uh he is known as aka Mr. Mace Man. So we're gonna talk about the mace. Uh if you don't know what the mace is, I'm surprised. Uh it's that big thing that people swing around. Uh, you've probably seen it all over social media. Um it looks like a lot of fun. I haven't tried it yet. I want to. And uh if I wasn't a digital nomad and so confined in the things I can drag with me everywhere we go, uh I would probably have one. Uh right now I just have a kettlebell. Anyway, let's get back to the mace. So it's really evolving, especially in the world of kettlebell. Um, kettlebells and crossfits seem to be two of the bigger uh early adopters of mace. Uh, but he talks all about it, the story behind it. And it's awesome. You know, it's it's cool to see a new um almost ancient piece of equipment coming back. But most importantly, what I really get out of this is Rick himself. Uh he is an amazing interview. Um, he's an inspirational interview. Uh his story um really fires me up. And, you know, I if I could sum it up, and he will um much better than I can, is that faith, and I don't mean this necessarily in the religious aspect, um, because I'm not particularly a religious person, but I do believe that if you have faith in what you're doing, right, the purpose that you have, um, if you do write by people, that great opportunities will come your way. Uh, you just have to be open to receiving them. And uh that's the message he has. You know, he didn't really see this level of success uh until you know kind of later in his career. And yeah, his words are inspirational. Um I love it. And uh, I've listened to it a few times since uh since we recorded it. And uh I hope he enjoyed as much as I do. So um before I get back into the interview, I want to talk about the fitness accelerator because uh it's surpassed my expectations. So it's an online community of fitness professionals with the purpose of elevating the fitness profession through better networks. And uh, you know, if you think you're connected, awesome, maybe you don't need it. But if you're not connected, you need to get connected. And I can tell you why, because now I'm starting to see the proof, you know, within this group is people are taking companies from a half million dollars to a million dollars like that. That was me snapping my finger there. It's a poor snap. But it's happening, right? And even some companies, you know, made an online nutrition company. Now it's about to expand to a 10x model because they made one connection with the right person in a different segment of the market. It's incredible. So go check it out. It's fitnessprofessional online.com forward slash fit accelerator and get connected, right? Fitnessprofessional online dot com forward slash fit accelerator. Fill out the application. We are very picky, of course, because we want to sustain uh the ethos of the group, you know, having people who give as much as they get and uh fill out the application. If you are accepted, we will offer two weeks, um, and that's a trial for both you and the community to make sure that everything uh is copacetic and that you're a good addition, and we'll go from there. So without further ado, this is episode number 92 with Rick Brown, aka Mr. Mace Man. Enjoy the show. All right, Rick Brown, Mr. Mace Man, welcome to the show. Thank you. I'm delighted to be here. Yeah, I'm excited to have you. I um, you know, I've had the opportunity to talk to you a few times now. And uh I know you've told your story many times, but I'm gonna ask you to tell it one more time uh on this show. So give us a story about you know how your evolution through fitness and how you came to be the mace man.

Oh, real simple. Uh I I started out uh you know an athlete in high school. I was a wrestler and I had marginal abilities. Um uh not really good coaching, but I really loved it and I loved the physical training part of it. And uh this was we're you know, we're talking the mid-70s back then. And uh if you wanted to pursue uh strength and conditioning training, generally you you went to muscle magazines and you tried to become a bodybuilder, which I spent a frustrating 20 plus years trying to do, realizing that it was a genetic sport. I always felt like a five-foot-tall guy trying to play pro basketball. Um, I'm not five feet tall, I'm a little over uh 6'4, 6'5, uh, which is pretty stretched out to be a bodybuilder, unless you have huge bone structure and and and a lot of other things that I just don't have. Um and I failed and failed and failed, but I always loved the training. I loved it. I loved the fact that you can still get stronger. And when I learned about strength and conditioning, and that that that regardless of your genetics, everybody can improve their strength and conditioning too, if you put enough effort into it, you can you could become very well conditioned. And uh when I found out about that, I was in. I was in. I was still frustrated because I was using traditional training methods. Then around the turn of the millennium, uh a little after 2000, I started reading articles in the magazines uh about kettlebells. Still had that bodybuilder mentality. Well, I can what happens when you you get too strong for kettlebells? You know, you you do you always have to buy bigger and bigger kettlebells. I didn't realize the the kettlebell um way of training is that you you alter your body position to make the movement more difficult, or you go for a longer period of time and less rest, which is what I I teach now. So I dived into kettlebells. At the time, I this is an interesting point. Uh I'm glad for bringing this up because at the time, around 2005, 2006, it cost the only place to get certified is a kettlebell instructor. And Eric, when I first saw kettlebells, I just something clicked in me, and I knew not only do I want to learn this, but I want to learn to be able to teach it. I want to learn to be good at it, good enough to teach it. So at the time you had to go to uh Minnesota. That was the only place in the U.S. you could really learn kettlebells and get certified. I had to pay, I think at the time we're on $1,800. We're talking 2,005 or six. I had to fly to Minnesota, I had to pay for a hotel. I had money for none of this. And uh went out and got another job. I got an extra job. It wasn't a hard job. I was just a bouncer at a club. That's you know, just stand there and look ugly. I I had that down. And uh I fortunately didn't have too many problems uh as a bouncer, but um I got the extra money. I was able to go to uh to to spend all that and and go to Minnesota and spend three three days there and get certified. And I was so delighted. I knew it spending all you know over $2,000 total, I never felt like I was overcharged, that it was overpriced. I definitely got my money's worth. It started me on a new career. I remember coming home, I had three kettlebells to my name. They were in the corner of my my living room, and my my uh girlfriend at the time, she's now my wife, uh, she looked at me and said, and said, if you think you can make a life and a career with those, I will back you. And uh that was all I needed. And uh fortunately, she has been my strength and my backing. Um that the kettlebells I did for a few years. I was really, Eric, I was so fortunate to uh talk to some people and and and present what I did to them. Uh I was always a I was always a customer at a uh video production store that sold martial arts uh and exercise uh videos. But back then, this was the video era, not even DVDs. And uh the company was named Budo, still named Budo Videos, large supplier of of martial arts and training DVDs now. So the owner became a client of mine. He's training very well for about a year, and then he says, uh, you know, I really like these kettlebells. I want to do a DVD on them. And I thought, great idea. Who are you gonna get to do it? And I was thinking of all the the names of the Southern California trainers. Who's he gonna? And then I thought, wait, he could fly in anybody who he wants to do this, so I started thinking about bigger names and he stopped me. He goes, No, Rick, we we want you to do it. I almost fainted. Yeah, um a week later we had it filmed uh and it sold around the world. I was really grateful for it. Uh the last chapter of the DVD, we went out of the studio and we went into an actual workout with kettlebells, uh a heavy club, I think, rope pulling, and the last thing we did was we swung a mace. Now that DVD sold in a lot of countries around the world, it's free on YouTube right now. But the comments I got the most were what was that thing? Now, this is around 2007. Uh, everybody's commenting on what is the mace? What does it do? Um, uh what's it good for? How do you learn it? And uh I wasn't stupid. I realized okay, if I was struggling as a kettlebell instructor, everybody wants to know about the mace. I took stock of everything I had, as far as every value I had, every valuable thing, and I had two things. I had some maces and I can talk. And I put the two of them together. Uh I started talking and and and teaching people in small groups on on maces, and then fast forward to 2013, uh, I said, Hey, I'm gonna do a seminar. I put it out there with the uh aid of social media. There will be a mace training seminar. Uh they showed up. They showed up, Eric. I was astonished. They showed up, they asked questions. I charged uh, you know, what I thought was a moderate amount of money, and and I was happy that they paid, and I was smart enough. And this were all you potential trainers out there, don't start thinking of your profit at first. Reinvest everything back into what you're doing. Make sure you have a photographer, make sure you have a videographer there, because if there's no pictures, it didn't happen. Nobody across the world on the internet wants to hear, they want to see. And so I started putting pictures out, started putting pictures out, quality pictures, quality photographers, and it worked, it builds interest. I started doing uh a lot of seminars in the Southern California area, which is interesting because it's difficult for me to get Southern California now. But I started doing them. I did San Diego, I did uh Central California, and then uh one guy in the kettlebell world, I uh he came to my seminar, Steve Cotter, very, very well known in the kettlebell world. He came to my seminar in San Diego and he said, I I I love uh this mace business. He goes, I like this, I'm gonna tell people about you. And uh I said, Thank you very much, Steve. Uh you know, you're welcome in anything I ever do. Well, he did. And uh he calls me a couple weeks later. He says, You're gonna get a call in 15 minutes from Ireland. And it it it started that way. And uh I used used him and still use him as a mentor, and he's done so much for me. I've been to Ireland uh three times uh and that led to uh well a total of what nine countries in the last uh since 2013, actually since 2015, because from 13 to 15 I was just in the in the US. But uh it it's been a wild ride, and I know that it's not over yet.

No, no way. It's just getting started. I mean, the whole the mace movement is just is just getting started. And so I'm my my curious questions leads me to when you when you started doing these videos and the photos and the all the media that you're producing, where were you putting it? Where were people finding you? Was it on YouTube? Was it Facebook? Where were you putting all of your your content?

You know, with all my talking about getting photographic uh proof and uh using social media, I'm still inept, remarkably inept at it. Uh Facebook and Instagram have been 90% of what I've done. Uh I do uh have a lot of stuff on YouTube. The real value of that is is you do get feedback. You do get feedback, and don't get hurt when people tell you you look like a fat old man or something like that. Uh I'm not kidding you not. Um my kettlebell DVD that is like about 12 chapters. You know, I got a chapter on stretches, warmups, the swing, snatch, press, all that stuff, Turkish getup. And then, of course, that last chapter outdoors with the mace. On one of the chapters, I think it's uh on warmups, right? On warm-ups. Uh, you know, each of the chapters has like 10,000 or so views. Well, this this one guy, I have no idea who he is, but uh he commented on my warmups chapter. No, nobody would ever really do those as warmups. Uh uh that guy, he's got a big gut and he looks like he needs oxygen. Who who is this old man? Well, I get about 10,000 on all those chapters. Do you know that about 40,000 people watched that video because they because they want to see who this fat old man was who's teaching warmups? I wish the guy would write about more of my stuff because he jacked up my likes and my hits and things like that. So whoever whoever he is, thank you. And and you have to understand it that uh you know they may talk bad about you, but they're still talking about you, and it does lead people to uh uh to check you out. And uh uh you're gonna get haters, expect that. You're going to get imitators, uh, expect that. Be respectful of all of them. Be respectful of your haters. In some ways, they're doing more for you than your most ardent supporters.

Yeah. Yeah.

That's that I've come to find out.

Yeah, I've heard that from a lot of people. I I don't have too many haters yet, uh, but I have talked to a lot of people who uh John Spencer Ellis, who's you know been in the industry a long time and you know, more of a TV celebrity type guy. He had a he told a story on one of my previous podcasts about how a hater did something and he used he turned it around and he made so much money off this hater's comment that he bought himself a new Porsche. And uh so he's like, I love haters. I love haters. Yeah, guys, if you're listening, you go check out the John Spencer uh Ellis episode on this podcast, it's really, really funny. And um I can't.

Oh, I definitely will now.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, here's here's the deal. If you've got something unique and unknown, like the mace, okay, uh, and you put it out there and you put it out there with a degree of authority, like I try to, I say this is this is you know the way I think it should be done, you're gonna have other people want to assert themselves. Now, the first time they put something out, they don't want the response to be, oh, well, I already saw Mr. Mace Man do that. Okay, Mr. May, yeah, that's what Mr. Maceman does. So they have to say something different. And if they say something different, some, not all, some feel that the only way they can break in is by saying something negative about what's already out there. You know, don't buy a Ford, buy a Chevy, this is why. Um, and and you get some of that, but if you're respectful, they come around in the end, usually, you know. Uh when you're successful, success silences most of your haters, not all of them, but but most of them.

Yeah. Well, I think you have to get um a certain level of exposure and success, and and that's when the haters start to come. So I always look at it like you know, when when you start to get that, that that's a good sign. Uh, because it's inevitable once you you hit a certain I mean, there's out of if you put a hundred people in a room, you know, one or two of them are gonna be assholes, right? That's just kind of the way it is. Right. You know, the bigger your your so you know I'm curious about what why do you think the mace has become so popular? What what are the benefits of training with with a mace? Like where how do you think this groundswell started? Because you know, you like you said, you were kind of shocked that people start showing up to the seminar and and paying you. And what why do you think retrospectively, why do you think it's it's it's starting to take off and what do you think it's gonna look like, you know, five, ten years from now?

Well, I think it started to take off because uh the uh 80s era of bodybuilding and and guys wearing men wearing big clown pants and uh uh how do I say this without offending uh half of the people in my in my roots? But uh I I think that people around uh 2005 and six were open to something that was edgy, hardcore, grungy, and and not necessarily pretty. And the mace fit into that, especially traditional mace style as I teach it. Um and and I I had at least a 50-50 female to male population at my seminars, even back then.

Wow.

Um so you know, women were open to wow, we want to do this hardcore stuff. And uh it it's it's like the kettlebell, the kettlebell paved the way for us. Any if if you're teaching uh you know Bulgarian bag or or sledgehammers or or flipping tires and stuff like that, you all we all have to be thankful to the kettlebell because the kettlebell cut the the weeds down that that kept uh all the unconditional trainers in regular traditional gyms. So I think I think the kettlebell led the way. Generally, myself, when I look for gyms that host me, uh I don't go for the uh established big name gyms. Uh I Google search uh, for example, uh kettlebell gyms in New Guinea. If there are any there, uh they'll probably be open to the mace. Kettlebell gyms in Portland, kettlebell gyms in in New York City. I don't want boutique gyms. Generally, they're never gonna hire a kettlebell or a mace guy to come and do a seminar. If you're the type that you want to go to a boutique gym, you you you want to have your latte waiting for you when you're done, you want to uh take a shower in their in their rock sauna shower with uh honey almond scrub. You want all that nice stuff, you know. But yeah, the the grunge effect was what I think uh brought the mace into uh closer to mainstream.

What about CrossFit gyms, Rick? Are they uh are they welcoming the mace?

Maybe 40%. 40% do. And uh that's that's about what I found. I I've done seminars at CrossFit Gyms more so in the in the last three years than than currently. I do I do better in mom and pop gyms that have a leaning towards the unconventional.

Yeah, yeah. You know, I'm curious too, you know, who's who's driving demand more? I mean, is it the the trainers who who love to to train with the mace and and want to coach it, or do you think it's the I guess lack of better term, the end user, right? The the the trainee. Like who's driving more demand in the mace right now?

I think when I first started out, it was the trainer. Uh he saw it as something he could he could learn and he can pass on. But because it has gotten popular now, I think it's the trainee who who uh is in greater attendance at my seminars.

Yeah, awesome. And what are the benefits of training with a mace? I mean, anatomically, physiologically, mentally, you know, what what what what benefits do you find from training with a mace?

Okay, anatomically, upper back, shoulders, grip, triceps. Um then of course conditioning. Uh mentally, you feel like you've done something, you let out your aggressions. There's a there's a great feeling of uh uh get you did something when you're done. It is cool as heck to do. We need to identify that there are two, there are now two styles of MACE training the traditional, which lends itself to competition, which is what I Teach the traditional that was started in India and is still done today in India. And that has kind of segued into a more movement-based, loaded movement-based training style with the mace, in which the amount of weight and repetitions that you do is not the goal, which is what I teach, but it is more the movement. Being that the movement takes center stage, the amount of weight takes backstage. So generally, the the mace flow people will use a lighter mace, uh, 10 pounds for men and maybe lighter for women. Some guys have gone a little heavier, but generally I find that it's it's 10 pounds for men. And generally for me, I start women off at 10 or 12 pounds and men off at 25 pounds. And so there's a difference. You've got one that's movement-based, and you've got one that is uh competition-based or uh weight and conditioning based. I teach that. The movement-based group, they would claim different benefits that they train their whole body. You know, a long time ago, uh, five or so years ago, there really wasn't too much movement-based at all. But I was talking with a business coach, and he was telling me, Rick, you've got to turn the mace into a whole body exercise. You've got to. You absolutely have to. That's the only way it's going to catch on. I said, it's already catching on. It's not a whole body exercise. The mace was not made for that. Um, well, the movement people have turned it into a whole body exercise, and they scream its value, and that's good. I don't do that. But and I'll tell you why. I did a uh uh seminar at an Olympic lifting gym in Brea, California, really hardcore gym. I think like eight women there and six guys there, and these were hardcore Olympic lifters and wrestlers. The women there had huge muscular quads, and I'm gonna stand in front of them and tell them that they can do a uh, if they do a dragon-twisting lunge with a ninja split, they can activate the deepest fibers of their quads. They're already experts at quads, they're they're spotting 400 pounds, and I'm not gonna insult their intelligence by telling them that they can reach uh deep levels of uh strength and conditioning in their quads when they can teach me about quad training. These people were experts. So I wasn't gonna do that. I say, listen, I'll tell you what the mace does and does better than anything else, and it's upper back, shoulders, and grip. Rotational strength. But if you want to try and turn it into something that does your whole body, well, hey, you can you can weld a can opener on the other end and then it can open your open your beer bottles when you're done. Let's turn it into other things. I'm not denigrating the movement style. I've come to appreciate it. Uh I teach what I do best though. And and the the movement style, if you're using a 10-pound mace, you could probably also get the same benefit doing the same movements holding a saxophone. Okay, and I know this is gonna upset a lot of people, but again, with the movement-based mace training, movement is the real thing you're doing there. Yeah, the avenue of resistance, your mace is is not important. It doesn't have to be a mace. Uh what I teach, you have to have a mace. You cannot do it with uh a trash can, you can't do it with a bag of beans, has to be a mace. And I teach people how to use the mace. And uh again, I'm not trying to be smart, smart ass or anything like that. Um some very good friends of mine are are movement-based practitioners, and we need movement. Yes, we do. Uh, if you need a movement-based practitioner, I can recommend the best to you. You want to learn the mace as it was originally intended to be used, that you come to me.

Yeah. So you you mentioned the origins are in uh are from India. So let's do what what are the origins of the mace? I mean, I presume like most uh athletic or you know strength and conditioning, a lot of it comes but from combat, right? And military backgrounds. And I just looking at the mace and the way it looks, obviously it looks like a weapon, right? Um what were the origins of it? Where did where did it come from?

Well, when when when everybody fought with swords, remember it wasn't uh it wasn't like in the movies one-on-one. It was your gang against my gang, and they all collided. And the whole goal of that sword fight, and the sword weighs about a pound, right? The goal of that sword fight was to slice through a guy as quickly as possible. So people started to understand that if they lifted something a little bit heavier than a sword, it would help them to be better on the battlefield. And that that started club training. And I always say that a club is a short mace and a mace is a long club, just to make it simple. But when people started wearing armor, nobody was strong enough to slice through armor. So they started to extend the length of the blunt instrument, and it became a club um a mace. In India, where they wrestle and have wrestled for thousands of years, they wanted something to strengthen their ability to grab you and throw you to the ground. And it was that overhead rotational strength that led right to the mace, and that's how they use the mace today. And that's how I teach it like that.

So yeah. Oh, interesting. Yeah, I didn't know that. I mean, I I you can look at the mace and you can make some presumptions about where it came from, right? I mean, obviously it's you know some kind of right.

But uh again, uh a mace, even even a 10-pound mace, very hard for you to swing it fast enough for it to be an effective weapon. If it hits you, uh yeah, it's gonna take your head off, but you're not who's gonna stand in the way and let it hit them? If I see someone swinging around a 10-pound uh ball of steel at the end of a pole, I'm I'm gonna get out of there.

Yeah.

So as a weapon, it would be better, better used to break down a door than um than to hit somebody with. But uh to strengthen a wrestler, yeah, it's really good at that.

Yeah, yeah, good to know. So um, you know, there's always this saying, right, that you're you're an overnight success that took 20 years in the making. Um, you know, I kind of see that like you've we've talked about this a couple times, one one on our our fitness blitz podcast, uh, which we recorded a little while ago, and you know, in previous conversations we've had about, you know, how the perseverance of of doing all this and how you know when you're going out on your own and and trying to create your own thing, you know, you're you're gonna get downtrodden at times, but there's always something kind of around the corner, you know, waiting for you if you stick with it. You know, talk talk to us about you know how failure, how you've dealt with failure over the years.

Okay, well, first of all, when when I was a frustrated bodybuilder, I remember reading something Arnold Schwarzenegger wrote, and he said, You have to love bodybuilding just because for no other reason. And I realized that I didn't love it like that. I needed it to give something back to me. Um you know, most people are greater strength and development and conditioning, but uh but so I knew the bodybuilding wasn't it, and I was becoming disillusioned. So when I found the mace, I realized I'd found something that could give something back to me, strength and conditioning. But the more I did it, I I found that this was something I loved just because. If Eric, if somebody came to me today and said, we have a stack of uh papers here and research reports that indicate that X, Y, and Z is 100% better than the mace at developing your grip, your strength, your conditioning, I'm still gonna do the mace. I will do the mace. People ask me, what's the mace good for? Yeah, I have an answer. I have my standard answers, I've given you that. But I love the mace just because. I will do the mace till the day I die. Um just because. So it was easy for me to persevere. It was easy for me to take the the people say, no, it's I don't think it fit in my gym. I don't think it'll work. It has no problem. I'm still gonna do the mace. When you love the mace like a golfer loves golf, nobody asks a golfer, what does it do for you? Nobody asks a surfer, what does it develop? Surfers surf when it's cold and raining. Surfers uh surf because they love surfing. I swing a mace because I love swinging a mace. Um, the movement group they are continually inventing, coming up with new movements and flows. God bless them. Some of them are very appealing to look at. Um I learned the basic moves of the mace, and I never got bored with them. I'm still not bored with them. I did a thousand ten to twos yesterday, I'll do a thousand today. Um, I never got bored with it. Uh is is it a stupid, silly thing? Yeah, it's a sum.

Yeah.

It's my golf. I don't have any golf clubs. I got a lot of heavy clubs, and I don't have any golf clubs. Okay, this is my golf. I uh my daughter golfs. I I I bought her a set of golf clubs once. I couldn't believe how expensive they were there, you know. So I don't feel bad about buying my maces and things like that. But uh some people golf, some people uh skeet shoot. I don't do that. This this is what I do. Yes, it it gives tremendous benefits. And no, it's not the only form of training I do. It's the one I'm known for, it's the one I'm most passionate about and the one I love. Um and I mean I really, really do love it. Uh I don't have to I don't have to explain it. Uh I will, I can, but I did I did earlier with you, I explained it's physiological benefits. But if you're coming to the maze just for physiological benefits, well, you can get those from other avenues. If you're coming from the maze because you've done it and you like how it feels and you love it, you're you're on my side.

Yeah, yeah, that's awesome. And you know, when you look, so you know, this this love that you have and um how is it how has it gotten through you through some of the the times when you probably were the most filled with doubt, right? Um, because I'm sure there's a lot of things that led up to that 2013 moment where you had that that seminar where you're like, holy crap, people showed up. Well, what is what has kept you going? Like, give me some examples of of how that that passion is left, because I think it will ring true is so many people, so many fitness professionals love what they do, right? They love helping people and they love this particular you know item that they're starting to get known for. And and I guess what what I'm looking for you is is to give some inspiration to those people through the passion that you feel for what you do.

Oh, simple. Uh I've always had to support myself, of course, and my wife. And uh so I always always had to stay employed, right? And then when I started uh doing the mace, I was always, you know, always reading uh uh motivational business books, still do, always listening to motivational speakers, still do. Um and one of them said, What would you do for free? What would you do uh for whether it ever works out or not? What would you do if if somebody was supporting you and you know you gotta have a reason to get up? And I I always I was always uh doing the mace. I was always training with kettlebells in the mace and and uh calling my friends up and telling them uh hey, come over and work out with me. I got this great workout. Well, well, they they never had time to do that, you know. Now that I charge money for it, uh, because I have to, those people, I have a waiting list, what can I say? Okay, it doesn't make sense. But when I when I found something that that I would do whether I fail at it or not, whether a thousand people come into this business after me and do better than me, I'm still gonna do it. If I never ever have another seminar, never do another podcast, never do a uh another magazine article, I'm still gonna be doing the mace. I will do it whether it works or not. I remember hearing the great uh motivational speaker, Jim Rohn. Uh most of us know who he was. Uh I was listening to him 30 years ago. I think I was listening to him 35 years ago. Yeah. Uh back on cassettes. Uh he said, he's he had a quote, he said, Tomorrow you will see me at the top of the mountain waving or dead on the side, because I'm not coming back without my prize. And that's how I feel. Yeah. Uh I made a promise to my wife, a pact to myself, and a covenant with God back in 2007 or eight, that I was going to spread the mace and its benefits and its its joy around the world somehow, some way. And back then, when I said I was gonna do it around the world, I I was thinking pretty much on the internet. I never thought that it would take me around the world. I said I was gonna do it or I was gonna die trying. And it worked out, and I'm I'm grateful, grateful to God. And and uh hey, people have something, I I have something that I love to share, and and uh it's just you gotta try the mace. If you haven't tried the mace, at least try it, and then you can decide whether it's not for you. But it's definitely for me, and it's definitely for the people that I've met.

Yeah, yeah, awesome, man. That's that's great inspiration. I makes me reflect, and it's it's uh I would podcast, I don't get paid to podcast. You know, I just love to do it. Um, you know, occasionally I'm I'm able to market a product or something like that, but uh I would do this, I do this, you know, my first 50 episodes, I just did because I liked interviewing people, you know, and uh it's it's kind of I think I'll I'm gonna be doing this in one way or another till till the day I die, uh or they pull me away from a microphone. So I think uh everybody can find that one thing. And um, you know, my my my question is because I'm intrigued. I I I travel, right? My wife and I have lived in six different places in 12 months, and I think I told you a while ago, all I have right now is just a kettlebell, right? I have a 53-pound kettlebell. And uh sorry for everyone to Europe, but that's you know, I do pounds. Um I I will I want a mace. What what do I if I'm you know, I want to get a mace, how do I start, right? Because I'm guessing it's the same question that most people have is do I just buy one and and kind of YouTube you swinging one around. What's what's the best way to get to get started in the world of mace training?

Good question because hopefully some of the people that are uh experiencing this podcast will say the same thing. Yeah, I don't sell maces. I I I don't I don't sell maces yet. I may sometime, I don't know, but uh I like to come at it, you know. I sell my instruction, I I like to come at it pure and clean like that. There's no uh greedy materialism uh advantage that I'm looking for. So I would say I would suggest that I that a male start with 20 pounds, a female start with 10 pounds. Okay. Buy an economical mace. There's great companies out there that uh sell them because if you don't have a mace, you don't know if it's for you yet. So you you go to like Anet has a great uh onit.com has great maces uh that people can start with Apollo Athletic. Um there's other companies, I would get a solid uh 10-pound mace for a female, 20 for a male.

Okay.

And uh I wrote a little guidebook on the mace. I I'll send it to anybody who wants it. Uh I can send it to you and you can share it with anyone. You can put a link and you can share it with anyone you want. It's old and outdated, but it's free. And the only reason I wrote it was because at the time, 2007 or so, 2010, there was nothing in print about the mace. There was nothing, and I wanted people to experience this value and benefits. So yeah, YouTube teaches a lot of people. The thing about YouTube is that you're gonna get a million different uh views. So pick and choose who who you want to see, and uh after that, then decide to get some professional instruction if you think it's for you. You know, there's there's enough people out there doing it now. It's not like it's you know, I was the only I'm not the only guy out there that teaches the mace. Also decide if you would like to try strength and conditioning, which is my style, or the movement base, which a lot of people are getting into. Actually, I think the movement, the movement crowd is is is growing quicker than than mine, and I'm fine with that. If if if a thousand people get into the movement style of the mace and they want to stay there, that's good, but it's there's a percentage of them that will want to bump it up a little higher and they'll contact me. So buy an economical mace and watch some good videos. If people uh want to look up my name on YouTube, I've got dozens of videos for free. Obviously, it's YouTube, and I can you can get a good idea of the basic stuff. And it's not just me on YouTube, just type in mace and dozens of people come up.

Awesome. It's awesome.

And and and start slowly.

Yeah. Yeah. Smart. So what do you what do you have coming up, Rick? Anything uh, I mean, as the date of this is uh August 17th, 2018. Um what do you have coming up?

Okay, August 25th, Sacramento, August 25th, Sacramento. Uh I got something big coming up in uh October uh 13th and 14th in Long Beach. You know, you've got you've got me out here pushing the uh the hardcore traditional style, and there's a guy named Leo Yurkides that pushes the movement flow style. And I thought, hey, wait, wait, wait, why why are we waiting for for somebody, some gym owner to uh uh hire me and then hire him or him than me? I called Leo up. I said, Leo, let's do something together. Yeah, we'll get your crowd, we'll get my crowd. Everyone can win. Yeah. And Leo's a smart guy, and he said, Yeah, let's do it. So October 13th and 14th in Long Beach, California. It's gonna be a full day of Leo certifying you in his in his unique style. And if you survive that class, you come back on Sunday, and I will certify you in my style. You will go away as a trainer, being able to offer to your clients the best of the best of the best. And uh we're looking really, we're really looking forward to that. A month after that, I'm going to be in November 3rd, I will be in Austin, Texas, and um doing a certification there at Morph Fitness Gym. I've got a few things in the works. I told you about them, but I just can't put them out there on in because unless I'm 100% sure it's gonna happen, I don't I don't want to put anything out there and have it taken away. So, but believe me, what I have in the works is bigger than anything I've ever done. And uh if it if it comes through, that'll be great. And if it doesn't, like I said, I'm still gonna be swinging the mace when I'm 90. Okay. Awesome. Uh, and and there's innovations, these these these this movement crowd, the movement crowd is different that it it's it's evolved even more. There's even a I would call it a an extended movement crowd, but that's that's a different story. But I'm just telling you that that that things morph and change and and and one thing becomes another thing becomes another thing. So it's exciting to watch every new day.

Yeah, yeah. Well, Rick, I I appreciate you coming on, man. It's been uh a huge knowledge bomb that you've dropped about mace training. And I I I think it's a really exciting area. I'm I'm gonna get one today. I'm gonna order a 20-pounder and um you know, and thank you for the inspiration too. You know, I think everybody here will find your experiences and and your words uh inspiring and motivational. So I appreciate you coming on, Sharon.

Uh I I'm honored to be here. Anytime you want me, I'm I'm here. And uh to all the people out there uh listening, uh if it's not the maze, find what you love, pursue it with all your heart and strength. I think we talked about once before the word desire comes from two Latin words, day uh meaning of, and sire meaning father. If you have a real true desire, you got it from the father. You know who the father is, and you got it from him, and he chose you to put it out to the world because he knew you would do it. He knew you would have the fire to uh uh endure the adversity and the and the the what is it, the apathy that some people have, and you're still gonna push on. He gave me the mace. I like to say that I didn't choose the mace, the mace chose me. Podcast chose you, Eric, and uh that's why we're here. Awesome.

Awesome. Well, thank you, Rick. Uh ladies and gentlemen, Mr. Mace Man, Rick Brown.

Thank you very much.

Hey FitnessFans, don't leave yet. It's your host, Eric Malzone, and I have a quick favor to ask. Actually, three favors. So, number one, if you're a fan of our show, I asked you to do something that takes under three minutes. Go to iTunes, please, and subscribe to our show. Please, please, please. It means so much to us. It's so important. And then give us a favorable review. We would really, really appreciate it. And uh, I can't tell you how much it means and helps us out. So I know it takes two minutes of your day, and uh it means a lot to us. So please do that. Number two, go to our YouTube channel, our fitness marketing alliance, and uh please subscribe to our YouTube channel there. Number three, if you like this episode or any of the episodes that we've released, share it on social. That's huge. That's a big deal for us. And when we put a lot of work into these episodes uh trying to give you great actionable content uh for the fitness industry. So that would mean a lot. And that's it. So we have some big plans coming up for the show. I'll be talking about that in the next couple episodes. But thank you so much for listening. It means so much. And uh if you have any questions, please reach out to me. I love to hear from everybody. Eric, E R I C at Fitness Marketing Alliance.com