Inside Tracker - Jonathan Levitt

Our mission is to really make it more accessible to the average person that's often looking for a quicker turn or a quicker impact. And so we have to have some tools that you know give that short-term gratification while they have helping them understand that like you're not gonna lose 50 pounds overnight, or you're not gonna you know drop your cholesterol 75 points overnight uh just by getting the mail twice.

Welcome back, fitness friends. This is the future of fitness podcast and interview series, and this is your host, Eric Nazo. And this is episode number 120. I get to talk to Jonathan Levitt, Insight Tracker. So I think this is kind of like a two-part interview, right? The first part is really everything you need to know about Insight Tracker, right? The second part is all the cool and interesting things to know about Jonathan Levitt. Uh his podcast, uh his uh experience as an endurance athlete and what he derives from endurance sports uh is really, really fascinating, very inspirational for lack of a better term. I know that word gets thrown out there a lot, but it's great. And I think you should go check out his podcast as well. In the first half of the interview, we talk about insight tracker and that technology. So uh no big secret. I like technology in the fitness and health space. I think it's transformative. Um, I think it's coming at you quick, and I think you need to stay on top of it because tools like Insight Tracker are something you can use within your practice to greatly add value and greatly extend your reach. So, what is it exactly? Well, I'll let him talk about it more, but here's a quick summary. You get a blood test uh every so often, I think it's every one to three months. Uh, they send you a report with uh comparison to where your blood report was last time and what you should be doing, like the top five things you should be doing for better health. It's really simple, right? Very a lot of complexity boiled down into simplicity, one of my favorite things to do, right? So, for instance, I asked him uh, you know, what's the one thing that he's learned? He's like, without a doubt, with all the data that they have compiled and they continue to compile. And side note, that's where all the stuff is going is the data collection. That's the most valuable thing. So he said, without a doubt, that men should be eating more oatmeal.

Right?

So I started eating more oatmeal. You know, it's delicious. Mix it with peanut butter, and uh I really enjoy it. So yeah, it's a great episode. You're gonna learn a lot, and I hope you enjoy it. Before we get into it, let's read a review from one of our listeners, Danny SB84, says, as a gym owner, I'm always looking for new podcasts to listen to that have new and valuable information in the industry. The Future of Fitness Podcast, that's my show, is just that. Love the guests that are on the show, keep it up. Danny SB84, I will. I will keep it up, not stopping anytime soon. So thank you for leaving that review. If you would like your review right on the air, uh good iTunes, subscribe to our channel and leave a nice review, and I will read it during uh one of our upcoming episodes. Brings me great pleasure and I really appreciate the support. It means a lot. And uh helping build a community is something that uh I know doesn't help help happen overnight. It takes one listener at a time, and I want you to uh subscribe. So this particular episode is brought to you by Certified Course Creation. So if you have a niche within the industry, a deep subset of knowledge, right? Perhaps it's time. Perhaps it's time for you to stop trading your time for money and get your legacy out there, right? And it can all be done with certifiedcoursecreation.com. You, you, talking to you, you can have your own accredited, certified online course. Yep. People can come to you for to get your knowledge, right? And you can make some money while you're doing it. Best part about it is you're not trading time for money anymore. This stuff works while you sleep, and it's a great way to set yourself apart within the field as well. So go to certifiedcoursecreation.com. It all starts with a simple phone call, right? If you're thinking, well, is this for me? Seems like a big project. No, it's not. It takes one small step, which is just go in there and booking a call. And uh the team at certifiedcoursecreation.com will tell you if it's a good idea or not, and if you should pursue it, because we have a great viewpoint of the industry and can tell you what's gonna work, right? So go check it out. Without further ado, let's get into it. This is episode number one two zero with Jonathan Levitt of Inside Tracker. Enjoy the show and let me know what you think. All right, and we're live. Jonathan, welcome to the show, man. Thank you. Yeah, yeah, I'm excited to have you. And uh, you know, like we were talking right before this, I was randomly listening to a Joe Rogan podcast on my drive from uh Big Sky to Whitefish, which is about a seven-hour drive. And half of that was spent with uh Joe Rogan as he interviewed David Sinclair, right? Um, geneticist and uh anti-aging specialist. And you guys came up and I was like, oh, oh great. I'm gonna be interviewing this guy next week. I can't wait to talk about this stuff. And you know, what you guys do at Insight Tracker is uh man, you know, I talk about it all the time on my various shows and and between my clients of how you know biometrics are are gonna be just widely available and are gonna change the whole landscape of health and fitness. And uh yeah, so enough of me talking, man. Give everyone a little background on yourself, um, how you uh how you evolved to the position you are now.

Sure. Um yeah, that was a great uh great podcast, and uh and we we've loved how many people have uh have gotten on board and started to take action to help improve their own health and performance uh as a result of it. But yeah, um so I got into the health and wellness space uh a couple years ago now, uh working for another company that was all about uh sports nutrition and working with a lot of athletes. And most of our customers were marathonners, and I had never run a marathon. And people were asking, oh, how do I use this product for for marathons? So I was like, okay, what the hell? I'll just sign up for marathon and figure it out. Um and I say that like kind of jokingly, but also kind of serious. Um, I had a bunch of friends that were running marathons and and um thought it was a good good time to do it. Uh so my the first race I signed up for was marathon. Um I ran a half marathon in in training leading up to that. Um, but I finished that race in pain and also like wow, this is like that. Crossing that first finish line of that marathon was uh a joy I'll remember for the rest of my life. And it was like you put so many hours towards training, and it was like this perfect culmination that was imperfectly uphill uh the end there. And um, and it was just like it was insane. It was I just loved it so much. Um, so I fell in love with with the endurance racing uh pretty quickly. And uh, you know, fast forward a couple years, I was at an event that Insight Tracker was uh sponsoring uh called Executive Athletes, hosted by Ken Lubin. Um and I was talking with the CEO and company president and founder about what I was doing for work, which was essentially growing a brand ambassador program from nothing to you know 500 uh ambassadors. And he was like, Why don't we hire you? And that's how I got to where I am today. That was that was uh over four years ago. Um, and it's been it's been an incredible journey. I was you know one of the first 10 or so to start working here at Insight Tracker, and we've quadrupled in size since then, um, which has been really cool to uh to watch watch evolve.

Uh awesome. So, what is your role over there, Insight Tracker?

What do you do? So I focus um primarily in the endurance space, working with endurance athletes, coaches, teams. Um I do some work with uh Pro Sports and working with uh strength trainers at uh on Major League Baseball teams and and hockey teams. It's been primarily those two in the in the pro sports department. Um and yeah, just working working with athletes and non-athletes to get started and and make the most of it.

Yeah, awesome. And I I have to give a plug out to Joe Bauer as well, because he introduced us from uh allaroundjoe.com. He's got a couple great podcasts as well. So uh thanks for the connection there, Joe.

Yeah, Joe is a great guy. He seems to know everyone and he seems to have done everything, which is super cool. Yeah. I got to meet him here in Boston, and uh, we were talking about his his own endurance pursuits and and strength pursuits. And you know, he's uh he's a CrossFit coach that's done 50 milers, and he's got that uh that desire to to go longer and to run really long, stupid distances just to like figure it out. Like, can I do it? Um and I find that fascinating. He's been he's been cool to get to know um over the last couple years.

Yeah, yeah, really cool guy. I believe right now he's um he probably stopped by and saw you on his uh his van trip as he's uh him and his girlfriend, I believe, uh are uh traveling around their sprinter van all across uh hitting all the the national parks.

They made a stop in uh Whitefish too, I believe.

Yeah, not I don't think they did. I think they are close to Glacier, but I don't know if I was there at the time. But uh yeah, I I I look forward to to meeting him in person. So um man, tell us what what is Insight Tracker?

So Inside Tracker, so there, you know, you can you can make so many different decisions around training and supplementation and diet and lifestyle, and you can see the same food on uh eat this, don't eat this, best foods for runners, worst foods for crosswood athletes, and it's the same food. And there's just so much clutter out there that exists around uh diet and supplementation and things like that that people are just uh you know paralyzed with too much too many recommendations that are opposed to it. You know, the same study will say, or different studies will say wine is terrible for you, or wine is great for you, or you know, carbs are the enemy, etc. Um what Insight Tracker does is our goal is to cut through that clutter and help understand who are you and what do you need. So it's it's not um best foods for humans, it's best foods for Eric or best foods for John and and best foods for for that person right now based on your current diet and lifestyle. So at a high level, what we do is tell you what the best changes to make to your current routine are. So eat this food X number of times a week. Uh here are some recipes to help you know get it into your diet. Um take the supplement in this specific dosage, you know, 5,000 IU vitamin D or 120 milligrams of magnesium. So very specific around the frequency and um what it does for you. And so we we hold a bunch of information about um food frequency, exercise, and lifestyle. And then based on whatever your goals are, we can say, you know, you could do 2,000 things differently tomorrow. These are the three to five things that are that are best for you right now. Do this. So it's again, distilling all the all the science that's out there around nutrition and supplementation and performance into here's a roadmap for what you should do if if you know boosting energy is your goal, or if better sleep is your goal, or reducing injury risk, whatever it might be. Um that's that's our core, you know, personalized guidance.

Oh man. Um, so you just earned yourself at least one more client. I'm in. Uh you know, it's funny when we spoke months ago, you mentioned you're like, there's one thing that you could definitively tell men is that they should eat more oatmeal.

Yep.

Yeah.

Why? Yeah, so we looked, we looked at some of so we have a like a check-in feature that allows us to understand at at least some level what are people doing with this information. And so we can look at baseline to follow-up tests and understand what are the interventions that people are committed to. And then self-reported, what what did they actually do? So we looked at um we looked at some of the most frequently chosen interventions and the most frequently uh prescribed to interventions. So we found that oatmeal has basically the highest impact for men and has potential to improve uh cholesterol, glucose, inflammation, so HSCRP, uh, and testosterone. So basically these health and wellness and performance related areas all stand to be improved by eating oatmeal daily. And I've seen it with my own data. Um I eat oatmeal every day now, and that's a that's a change I made. I used to hate oatmeal and now I love it. I put you know peanut butter in or uh chia seeds or blueberries or whatever. Um protein powder and and uh yeah, it's had a it's had a measurable impact. Um and it's definitely helped. And so it's cool. We can see um, we can see stuff like that, like what works, and we can also see what doesn't work. So you always hear uh vitamin D is you know, you should you should have optimal vitamin D for performance and for sleep and mood and recovery and all that good stuff. People are like, oh yeah, eat fish, eat mushrooms, eat you know, fortified dairy, things like that. And we looked and we found that the only um meaningful intervention was vitamin D supplementation. So for some, the fish and standing outside and all that stuff worked, but from a statistical significance standpoint, if you want to improve your vitamin D, you must take a vitamin D supplement. That's the only way to to guarantee it'll improve. Whereas some other values can be improved through through nutrition instead or diet instead.

Yeah. Yeah, it's interesting. I mean, vitamin D, um, you know, I lived in California most of my life. But now that, you know, I've been spending on, I've been moving north systematically. Uh, you know, over time, it's it's been a big thing. I I take uh a ton of vitamin D just because I even if even on a sunny day here in in northwest Montana, you're not gonna get that much vitamin D, right?

And um But but even still, we we have uh like pro baseball players that are training outside at spring training, whether they're in Florida or they're in Arizona, and they're outside for you know three to seven hours a day. Still, still low. And so it's um it's just all so unique that you can't assume that just because you're standing outside, you're getting that getting that impact.

Yeah. Well, you know, I I've been really excited to talk to you because I have this vision, right? Of how I I've actually somehow found myself as a person that people ask a lot of questions about fitness technology and health technology because I mean, dude, I'm not that technical as a person. I can't explain to you how it works, but I talked to enough companies in in this area, enough uh devices. I mean, just this morning I talked to three different SaaS companies for gym software, right? And when I look and I get asked this question, like, well, what is the what is the future of it look like, right? Well, obviously the name of my show is future of fitness, but um I I see it like this. You know, I see like the stuff that you guys are providing, right? Real, almost real time, if not, you know, very, very up-to-date information on the individual, um, how their their biometrics are shifting over time, what needs to be supplemented. And I see it, hopefully, bridging a gap between the health and the fitness professional, right? Um do you share any of that vision? Like how do you how do you see this this work in between those two faculties?

Yeah, so uh our goal is really to continue to to innovate in the in the tracking and analysis department. I think a lot of the shortcomings that exist out there are overpromising and underdelivering, or like capturing data that's meaningless. We're capturing data just for data's sake. You're you're looking at things that you can't really provide guidance on. So so our our mission is to to pull in as many different data sets as as possible. So you look at one-day microbiome, or you look at physiological tracking or monitoring. So like we're a garmin watch, you have resting heart rate, you have sleep data, you have activity data, and and to be able to provide insights on on top of something that you're testing quarterly or biannually or something like that. So something that's getting tracked literally every minute or every night or something like that, that's where that's where you can truly make make the impact. There's a lot of uh you mentioned the the the SaaS products, there's a lot that's that they're tracking that you don't really do anything with the data. Um are you wearing uh what's what's the ring you're wearing?

Oh it's not an aura, but I'm gonna get one soon. Yeah.

Yeah, so like stuff like that, um, it's super cool because you can make meaningful data, you can make meaningful changes with the right type of guidance. Um I know it's sort of like a different answer to to the question, but um that's that's our mission.

Yeah. So give us some details, John, like how how does insight tracker work, right? Um, from both like an end user to a coach, like how how does give us give us those insights, the nuts and bolts.

So in the in most of the country, what you can do is you can log on, order a order a plan from our from our site with our ultimate being our most comprehensive. We send you a lab slip. So you order a plan, you tell us food frequency, exercise, lifestyle. So we're personalizing this to you and your specific needs. And then from there, we send you a lab slip, you print that out, bring it to a local lab, and they do a blood draw, and we receive the data within about a week or so. And then um you say, okay, here's what to do. And then the idea is, you know, in three to six or nine months, you do another test as a way to help evaluate that progress and see how see how those interventions that you've selected. So oatmeal every day, once a day, fish twice a week, something like that. Um, see how that has impacted at the you know, at the biochemical level and and what else you can do to to continue to improve.

Okay. So it's um it's like is it a subscription subscription-based service?

So the way that it works right now is you order a plan. So you order a test and um you pay basically pay per test. So we offer a discount when you order multiples as a way to help evaluate that progress. Um and then yeah, so it's it's not a subscription uh today, but uh yeah, it's per test.

Okay, okay. And then um so how does a reporting come through? Is it come through like you guys just send a report and then it has very, very, very specific action items to take from it?

So there are two different ways to look at it. You can either look at it per biomarker, so we create an optimal zone based on your specific demographic information. Uh so looking at height, weight, age, gender, activity level, and ethnicity. Um so you know, your normal range might be here, but your optimal range is here or here, somewhere in the middle. So we give diet and lifestyle-based guidance on how to how to get into that optimal zone. And then you can also click and see the reference studies that we're we're using to make those recommendations. So the way the platform works is our science team has basically compiled a massive database of PubMed studies that require specific recommendations based on who you are and what you're trying to achieve. So if high this, low that male age this uh runner, uh, then show this recommendation. Or if CrossFit athlete or female or Asian or African-American or whatever, so as specific as as possible, um, they get a recommendation that's specific to that demographic. Um and then the other way to look at it is a goal-based approach. So instead of looking at the individual biomarkers, you can say, I want to boost energy, or I want to uh improve longevity or overall health. And the system will go from the you know 2,500 things that we can recommend for you down to five. And your five are going to be different than my five, and they might be different each time around based on the based on the data, or they're different based on the goal. So the platform will pull the six to eight biomarkers, so nutrient hormone levels, that are related to those goals and look at basically the most efficient foods that are gonna target those areas and help optimize those areas. So let's say there's been a research study on beans uh improving cholesterol if you eat beans four times a week. So we don't know, so we know that you don't currently eat beans because you've reported that. Let's say your cholesterol is a problem and you're willing to eat beans, you'll see a recommendation you should eat beans four times a week. To improve your glucose and cholesterol levels. Whereas if you're already eating beans four times a week, and we know that, we're going to recommend something else. So, you know, eat more fiber from this source or um take a garlic supplement or you know, something like that that will that will address um basically the next most valuable if you're already doing the that most valuable.

Yeah. Interesting. So sounds like you take a lot of very, very uh complex data and you give people the easiest steps.

Exactly. So it's it's sort of like a um like a cheat sheet to to progress. And so we've done work with um with some pro sports teams that are like, I don't have time to go through all of the all of the data that you guys are providing with uh our athletes with. What do I do? So that's where that action plan was born out of. It was uh basically uh an automated um consultation that says, do this X number of times a week, do that X number of times a week, given that specific person. So now we have pro teams that are literally printing out this action plan, putting it in the locker of each athlete and saying, Here's your plan, go do you know for three months, and we'll check back at the all-star break. Um something like that. Whereas previously they were getting no nutritional support, or they were seeing somebody in in spring training, and that was it. Um, or they would see someone you know in the off season and that was it. And and so now we're able to say, look, here's you know, Joe Schmo's uh recipe for success, and here's John Smith's recipe for success, and here's Eric's recipe for success. And so it's that personalized approach at scale that allows a coach to um have meaningful uh impact across the board for a large group of athletes. We have um military accounts that have you know hundreds of operators that uh simply don't have time uh for better or for worse to spend you know an hour with each um soldier. And and so they're getting this highly drilled down and and customized plan that you can have a five-minute conversation about how to take advantage of the foods that are already available to these people. You should look at the fish and you should look at the meat, and you should look at, you know, just take the take the damn vitamin D supplement. Um so it's it's cutting out um you know hours of analysis on the um provider's side so that they can do what they do best, which is the applied side. So what what we do on the back end is way more complex than any single human can possibly process. There are there are literally dozens of variables that go into um the recommendations that we make, and it's simply too much for a human to do. Um, but if you're getting the output, you can help whoever it is apply, okay, you should eat the the high iron uh foods at this time of day, away from these foods. Or, you know, they can help with nutrient timing, or they can help with uh you know when when or how or what supplements to take. Um so it's really allowing a uh healthcare provider or healthcare professional to do what they do best, which is that support role, versus um, you know, getting into the weeds of of all these dozens of variables.

Yeah. So uh Jonathan, is it do you go John or Jonathan?

Either's good.

John, yeah. Uh genetics. How's that how's that coming into play?

So um, whereas the the blood testing changes every time you do it, your your genes don't. So um there are a lot of companies that that are or a lot of people are interested in using genetics to create customized meal plans. And the problem the problem with doing something like that is you can't evaluate progress because it never changes. And there's no way to know is it working? Like you may have a likelihood to have high cholesterol, but you might not have high cholesterol, or you might be more likely, like I'm I'm likely to have um low magnesium, and I actually do have low magnesium, so I'm not able to replenish my magnesium stores from a dietary standpoint, so I need supplementation. So the the genetic testing sort of confirms and validates things that we see in the blood work, um or can give uh higher um power, higher, higher confidence to needing to focus on something. So let's say you were you are more likely to have high cholesterol, but you don't have high cholesterol, but you're borderline. Right. You might not have thought, hey, my borderline high cholesterol or my my borderline, my optimal, but borderline high cholesterol is not a problem. But now that you know that it is down the road or it's potential to be a problem, you might actually think about focusing on something like that. Um and then there's some stuff that's more of the entertaining variety, like strength or endurance focus or or power versus endurance, uh ratio. Um it's just sort of entertaining to hear and and see that some of our elite endurance athletes, their their likelihood of being elite endurance athletes is higher, and they are. It's just cool to see some stuff like that. Um but yeah, we have a DNA plus blood report that that merges those two data sets and matches what uh what your likelihood is with what you actually have. And then each time you complete a new test, new blood test, it refreshes that report and and gives you new guidance as a result.

So what like how many, you know, if you have an estimate, like how many of your clients or end users are um you know athletes or just general population?

So I'd say it's mixed. Um so you mentioned the Joe Rogan uh podcast. Majority of the people have signed up from that, and there have been a lot. Those are the people that like that's the general population, and that's you know, there's 250 million of those types of people that are just interested in in feeling better throughout their day. Whereas we have tons of of high-level athletes or just athletes in general, you know, someone with a desk job that you know likes to run far or um you know, strength train in the morning. Um so it's a it's a pretty good mix of of each, both using the platform for very different purposes in a very similar way. So our mission is to really make it more accessible to the average person that's often looking for like a quicker turnaround or a quicker impact. And so we have to have some tools that you know give that short-term gratification while they under helping them understand that like you're not gonna lose 50 pounds overnight, or you're not gonna you know drop your cholesterol 75 points overnight uh just by eating oatmeal twice. Um so it's it's balancing the you know, the athletes that are using it for that 1% when they're running 100 miles or um training for the CrossFit games or something like that, uh, and and balancing that with the our mission being to help um all humans improve uh health and quality of life through a personalized approach. So we go to the populations that need us, like we know what it's like to be injured or bonk or uh not have enough energy. And and that's a tangible problem that we're gonna fix, or like I have a time goal or I have a distance goal. I'm gonna do whatever it takes to to achieve that. Whereas most people would, you know, they'd like more energy and their boss would like to have like them to have more energy, but it's like it's not necessary. Yeah, um, it's not a pain that you have right now, it's a problem, but you don't need to fix it. But um, you know, if you're running a marathon and and you're exhausted all the time, like you need to fix that. Um, so that's sort of the discrepancy between the the the two populations.

How how big are you guys now? Like how many end users do you have roughly? How how's the company doing?

Yeah, last company has been around since 2009. Um we have tens of thousands of users. We just published our first paper, uh, and the first paper uh of its kind in the industry um last fall, basically validating the the approach of algorithm-based nutrition guidance. Um we went, like I said, you know, five to ten employees when I was when I started. We have almost 40 now. Um so it's it's a sign that uh people want this and and the industry is um is is supporting it. Um when I started uh my role was basically convincing people, hey, you should you should think about doing this. And now my role is hey, we're the best. Uh you've probably heard about this from other companies that are spending tens of millions of dollars on on advertising. Our platform is better. And here and here's why.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Interesting. So where do you think this is all going? I mean, and this is this is still early stage stuff, right? Like we're put me like five years in the future. What do you see all this type of tracking and and technology going?

So imagine that your your smartphone pings you and says um, hey, you don't have a meeting between uh two and three. It's sunny out, your vitamin D is low, you haven't moved in a while, go for a walk. It's sunny out. And it's like it's sort of like that life coach model where um the goal is extreme personalization. And for some, that's too much. Uh and for others, they're looking to get this type of guidance in in all aspects of life. Like we're building a meal planning tool where for athletes, they're they're able to understand, okay, on a high training day, this is what I should be eating. On a low training day, this is what I should be eating. On an off day, this is what I should be eating. Um, and then, like I said, merging the the physiological monitoring data with microbiome or you know, all the different data sets so that oh, you slept poorly last night and this is becoming a trend. Your magnesium is low and your vitamin D is low. You should uh you should take those supplements you know before bed, and we'll see if if your sleep improves. And you know, a week goes by, oh look, your sleep, your sleep quality has improved, or two weeks or three weeks, or whatever, your sleep quality has improved. That's great. Keep doing what you're doing. Yeah, so it's it's that um it's that more frequent feedback loop. Um one of the big pain points today is that you actually have to go in and get a blood draw, and like it's a pain in the ass. Yeah. With a needle in your arm, it's not it's not comfortable, and uh, it's not fun. So like the the biggest hurdle is that people are afraid of needles, myself included, and uh they just don't want to do it. And so there are things that are um there are products that are being created that are going to allow the um the blood draw component to basically be a non-issue. So there's a company based here in Cambridge that um it's basically using uh like a vacuum technology, micro vacuum technology. So you you put it on your on your arm, and it uses this this their micro needles and it uses this um vacuum technology to extract a very small amount of blood, and they they can support, I think it's 30 different biomarkers. So basically our almost our entire uh testing uh line. Imagine if you could do this on a weekly basis for you know 5% of the cost that it is today, you could get really detailed insights into how you're what you're doing is impacting. For the majority of people, that's that's way too frequent. But think of a uh baseball team where they have five pitchers and they want to know who is best on what amount of rest. So a conversation we've had has been can this athlete go on four days of rest? Can this athlete go on five days of rest? Does this one need an extra day? And how do you optimize the the guys on a roster based on the you know the moving parts? So we had this idea or a team had this idea to test four times around a start and understand, okay, who needs more or less rest, and how do we how do we optimize our rotation based on who needs what and when the concept of doing four blood draws for a major league baseball pitcher in season, it's probably probably too much, probably too much blood in season, and you're not really getting a reliable read um in the offseason. But let's say you can do that for almost no impact, then you have these extreme um this extreme amount of information around how do I get that that last one percent out of out of each athlete? And how do I how do I get the most out of the the guys that I have available? We got a very very direct answer from uh from the military one day, and they're like, uh when you're when you're fit, you're harder to kill. Well, it's like at at the at the very you know basic level, um readiness is a factor. And and we're we're doing more and more to the military, and it's super cool to be able to help optimize uh these men and women that you know their life is on the line. And the more that we do to help their readiness, the better they're able to do their job, which is in return helping us all.

Yeah, yeah. Wow, man, there's so much to think about here. Well, you know, so obviously it sounds like there's gonna be you you can see some kind of AI component coming into it, right? That processes the information, gives people that feedback. Hey, go outside, take a walk, right? Where where are you guys in line with with that type of development?

I guess it's in progress. Um we're working on the integration with some of the wearable devices at the moment. That's that should hopefully be out this year in terms of uh receiving uh sleep data and activity data, which would be in the next couple months. Um some of that uh higher level you know do this now type stuff is definitely further down the road. Um probably need some sort of app to facilitate that and start to work on the development of that app that can support that type of insights, but people want it and people are moving to having that data accessible always. There's been a lot of changes in healthcare that make security and and accessibility more uh readily available and possible with some of the regulations that have changed and some of the capabilities that have been created. Um so it's cool to see that that desire is there and that need is there. I feel like we're at the forefront of uh delivering that with guidance to the population.

John, what what other technology are you keeping an eye on within the industry? Is there anything else that fascinates you out there?

Um I like the Is there anything else that's um that's a good question.

Um I mean there's there's just so much there's so much that's being exposed around like this doesn't work or this, you know, the they overpromised again. Um I love all the the technology around uh the training that I'm doing. And and so I'm a big Garmin fan. I use Strava. Um and some of the technologies and capabilities that that they're building in from a predictive analytics standpoint or a like a readiness to to perform uh standpoint is is interesting. And then it's sort of like a cat's 22. Like, what if it's race day and your watch is telling you you're you know you suck and you're not you're not ready to go? Like what about the mental, what about the mental aspect of of seeing that you know you're minus four today or you're plus ten? Like, well, what if I'm not plus ten? Um so there's there's a lot being talked about in the in the um psychology side of things and the the mental side of things. And I think the more that we can do to support that area and and uh bringing out the best uh from a mental standpoint, uh there are all these headphones that vibrate in a certain way and do these certain things that you know if you can if you can get the most out of yourself from a from a mental and mental health and mental um readiness standpoint, um, that's super cool. Like my best races have always been when I was like super happy and surrounded by friends that were also racing. And like how do we how do we elicit that type of response? And maybe it just has to be uh right right day, right time. Um, or maybe there's something that you know we can we can help uh stimulate that uh response.

Yeah, yeah, it's interesting, and I agree. I think you know, with all of the metrics that we have available, especially like HRV and you know, essentially what tells us how stressed are are we at that given moment from a um you know, from a physiological standpoint, it messes with you. Like you may wake up and be like, you know, let's say, let's say it's a non-athlete, let's say it's you know, someone who has like a big uh presentation that day, right? At their office or whatever. And you know, they wake up one morning and their HRV tells them that they're you know in the amber or in the red. And uh then it really sort of messes with them. They wake they woke up feeling fine.

Right, yeah, right.

But now they got this thing in their head like I'm not optimal, I'm not optimal. What am I gonna do?

Sorry, boss, I gotta, I gotta push to tomorrow.

Yeah, yeah. I got I got amber on my on my HRV, dude. I can't do this, I can't do this presentation today. I think that's a really interesting thing about it, is like we we um as all this evolves and just gets more and more incorporated into daily life and we just get used to it, right? Even relying on it is you know, we can't seem to forget the the human component of it all, right?

Yeah, interesting, man. Chatting with a sports psychologist on my podcast uh later today, and and we're we're diving into some of those questions around like what do you do if you get to race day and you're just not like you're too nervous or you're you're not feeling it, or like you know, stuff like that where you can't just bail because you're not ready.

Right.

Uh how do you apply that to regular life as well?

Yeah.

Yeah, it's an interesting dilemma.

Yeah. Let's talk about your podcast, man. I know it's uh kind of just you how how long have you been doing it? Well, how many episodes are you in now?

So I've recorded four. Um I've released none. I uh I'll by the time this one airs, I'll probably have released uh I'll probably have released the first one, or I will hopefully have released the first one. Uh planning to do it today. Um the podcast is called For the Long Run, and the goal is to explain and and talk about what keeps people motivated, what what's exploring the why and understanding um what gets you out of the door or what gets you out the door, what gets you you know onto the trails, onto the roads, uh on a daily basis. And um the the theme so far has been I've spoken with a couple uh pro athletes and a couple um people that have been doing it for a while, um, and a coach. And the the theme has been uh loving the process and not um not being tied to the outcome, which is really interesting if you think about a professional athlete who you know their their salary or their contracts are outcome-based. Yep. It doesn't matter that they love their job, or it doesn't matter that they love training. If you're not, if you're not um achieving results, you're not gonna get get that next contract. And so I asked, I asked um Ben Rosario, who's the coach of the Hoka uh Northern Arizona elite team. So he's got he's got 15 athletes that he coaches that are all professionals. And I said, like, how do you how do you balance between the outcome and the problem? Process. Like, man, if you love the process, the outcome will come. Like you'll you'll get results if you're if you're bought into the process and the journey. Uh you don't have to say, I want to win the New York City Marathon, or I want to, you know, take third or podium, or you have to love what you're doing on a daily basis and and find ways to enjoy the ups and the downs. And if you do that, the rest is gravy, but it, you know, you should figure it out and the the results should come over time. And so, yeah, that's my goal is just to explore that conversation and understand who these people are and what what what gets them excited and then what can what can other people learn from it.

Yeah.

And so through my work with through my work at Insight Tracker, I get to travel a lot to races and and meet these athletes. And I I've been having these conversations for three or four years over dinner or over coffee. And I felt like I've been just like hoarding all these like incredible gems of uh insights. And like I I asked this question to a guy in uh Colorado Springs. We had just run up the Manitou Incline and uh ran back down and then um we got dinner. I asked it, I asked him a question, and he talked for like 20 minutes. And I'm gonna need to record like go back and have that same conversation again because it was just like full of of gems that that people can take away, whether or not they're endurance athletes or or athletes in general. But I was just having these conversations on a regular basis and I was like, I need to I need to share this. Um and so that's that's the goal um with uh with for the long run.

Yeah, awesome, man. Yeah, it's it's interesting. I mean, almost all of my my greatest lessons in life business have all come from sport and fitness, you know. Um and some of my most, I guess, prized memories come from sport, you know, and uh, you know, it's it's a really fascinating thing because you it's just not it's not just the physical, it's it's such a mentally demanding, especially in endurance, man. Um, you know, I got into half marathons, right? And marathon in uh, you know, I don't know if you've ever heard of the Pier-to-Peak one in Santa Barbara, California, but that that one I did three years in a row. And that was some of the most grueling, other than mountaineering, was some of the most grueling mentally challenging things I've ever done. You know, you run up a hill for 13 miles.

And uh it's super cool because you there I read uh I think it was an outside magazine article that looked at um successful like traits in successful people. And many of them were endurance athletes. And these lessons that you learned you know before 8 a.m. transfer over to your day-to-day and your work life and and your perception of like what you can what you can do. And so like here at Instachecker, we have these massive goals to help the lives of all humans. And whether that means every single person becomes a customer or we do things in a way that you know affects the food chain or you know, whatever. Um there are things that would scare a lot of people, and including us, uh, in terms of like the scope and the scale of of what we're trying to achieve. But it's possible. And and the only way, you know, if you it's a corny line, but you know, shoot for the moon and or shoot for the whatever, shoot for the stars and you miss and you land on the moon. Right. It's not bad. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like you apply that to a marathon. Your goal is sub three, you run 305, 310, whatever. You've still done something pretty freaking awesome. Um and so these lessons that that you learn in in sport, like anything is possible. Uh you can do more. You can you're always capable of of pushing further or um hurting more or you know, whatever. Um, that's relevant in in all aspects of life, whether it's work, whether it's personal life, whether it's relationships, um, it's transferable across the board for sure.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, it's that thing where you, you know, you you start training or you start working and eventually you adjust to that workload, right? And then you're it becomes automatic, right? And then once it becomes automatic, then you're able to do more complexity on top of it.

Yeah. Yeah.

And you continually level up, right? And that's a you know, I I always say that simplicity allows for complexity, right? Because if you can just when things become automatic in your life, then you can start working on things that are bigger. And it really comes down to just habits and repetition.

Yeah.

You know, like life, so many problems in life uh can be solved by repetition and habits, right? Sure. Yeah. So what out of curiosity, what made you what why why a podcast, right? Why not like um interviews, you know, on a YouTube channel or um even writing a blog? Like what what fascinated you about podcasts?

So I think that it's so my goal is to do most of mine or as many as possible in person. Um and so I think there's a rapport that you get from in-person or even like what we're doing screen to screen here. Yep. Um, but even still, there's just like I did a podcast in Flagstaff um with a pro runner that was out there, and she came to the hotel and we sat in the lobby, we talked for 20 minutes. And you just like build that rapport with with the people, and then you have those things that you can talk about five minutes later, ten minutes later, whatever. And and you don't get that sort of emotion and you don't get that uh rapport in a Q ⁇ A, you know, hey, I'm gonna email you some questions. Um I don't really like video, so I chose not to do uh not to do YouTube. Yeah, but I got you here. Um so so the other problem is um doing so much of doing doing so many of these podcasts on the road, like I'm learning quickly that you need to really figure it out uh and figure out where you're gonna record. Um I had dinner with a with an athlete in Phoenix and we didn't record a podcast because we were in a busy restaurant next to a highway and there was nowhere possible to do it. So I missed an opportunity um because I would rather have done it uh in person face to face. We'll probably do it at some point. Um but you know, these complexities that the the payoff of doing it in person versus over the phone or whatever, um I feel it's it's worthwhile uh to do it to do it that way. And then in terms of why I guess finally answering your question, um I love listening to podcasts while running and um specifically on on long runs only. Um and so it's sort of like a double, like I'm planning to release them every Friday so that people can listen to it to the for the long run podcast on our I get it.

Yeah, yeah. Oh full circle, got it. For the long run.

I'm gonna I'm gonna take credit for it. Yeah, yeah, that's great, man. What are some of your favorite podcasts? Um, so I love listening to the Billy Yang podcast. Um, Billy is a content producer, filmmaker. Um he has his way of just like pulling out people's guts. And and I mean that in the best way possible, like filling what really matters to people. And and his podcast is really an inspiration. And and um his his podcast, I don't remember if it was his or or Mario Frioli's, who's another uh runner and coach, they were chatting on I think it was Mario's podcast um about the the state of digital media and how like everybody has a podcast these days. Um and what they got down to was iron sharpens iron, and the more um the more people that are out there, the more it just requires everyone to step up their game and elevate what they're doing. And the two of them are really able to to lead really interesting conversations with not just elite athletes, but um elite humans and people that are just really freaking awesome. Um and so that was a lesson that uh Eric Strands of Ultrarunner Podcast gave to me. He's like, yeah, don't just get people that you know won a race, and you know, that's why they're famous. Find people that have a really compelling story and a really interesting um experience or whatever, and and don't just talk race results. And so that's really been the approach that I've taken. I mean, fortunately, most of the people that um many of the people that I'm planning to interview have also achieved athletic success, but they're they're super interesting people on top of that. So I have a feeling that we're not gonna talk a lot about you know so-and-so winning Western states or or blah, blah, blah, coming in third at New York City Marathon, or you know, whatever. Um, but rather like, why did you get into it? And and where where do you see yourself and and uh how is what you're doing helping the next generation and and stuff like that? Um, that's more than just like, yeah, I ran really fast and I'm proud of my result, and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Um, there's enough of that that exists out there. And and yeah, I don't want mine, I don't want mine to be that.

Yeah. Well, you know, the the thing about podcasting, and uh, you know, I'll kind of make a couple points here before we wrap it up, but um, yeah, there is a lot of podcasts out there, uh, but the overwhelming percentage of them are not consistent. Um, you know, it don't get past uh episode seven, right? Right. Um, so the numbers are are not entirely uh revealing of the truth, you know. Um I think something like that, Ben Ben Reuter, who has a moving to live podcast. We were talking um recently, he'd be actually I'm sure he'd love to have you on a show. Uh we're we're recording Tuesday. Oh, you are? Okay. See you. It's a small world, man. It's a small world. Um, yeah, it's really funny. But you know, it's you can ask him, he has a stats, but I believe it's something like 60% of uh podcasters haven't released an episode in like a year, right? So people start, but they don't continue. And uh, you know, anything like we're talking about, you know, anything worthwhile is gonna take repetition, it's gonna take time, um, it's gonna take habits. And uh, you know, that's a cool thing about it. It's it's an art form that, in my opinion, uh, you know, um, it's an art form. That's it. You know, it it takes time, you know, the art of the discussion, um, understanding what people uh want to hear, pulling out stories just so you're talking about the guy who can pull out guts, right? Um, that's uh it's a it's a really cool thing. And you know what? It translates to everyday life too.

Uh although um sometimes I'm sure my wife cringes at dinner parties with some of the questions I ask people, but like people are so superficial these days and they know like what do you do for work and what do you, you know, blah blah blah blah blah. What kind of car do you drive? Who cares? Ask like ask questions that um why are you here? What do you what what gets you up in the morning? And you'll be the most interesting person at the dinner party if if you're just like spitballing these questions and people are people are talking because people love to talk about themselves and love to talk about like what actually matters. And there's there's a lack of that in the um social media world these days, and it's all just like had the best vacation ever, or like, you know, whatever. Um but but these, you know, that that's how I think people stand out. It's you know who's asking the the tough questions and um actually getting an answer and and moving things forward, which is which is cool.

Yeah. Well, and it's not just asking questions, but actually asking questions to hear the answer and not just think about what you're gonna say next. And uh one of the beauties of podcasting too, that I really love is um, and I talk about this every now and then, is that you know, for this period of time, for this, you know, 45 plus minutes that we've been recording, um, I haven't checked my cell phone, I haven't looked at my email. I've just been all about John, right? And uh those moments in time nowadays, it's fucking rare. You know, and uh I wish there was more of it. But this this provides, even though we're not in the same room, right? I'm all about John right now.

Right.

And that's rare.

Well, you're you're I'll show you where we are. We are we're in this little uh little tiny cubicle of of a little uh it's like a fish tank.

Yeah.

We're sitting over at the other side of the fish tank and uh we're having a good chat here.

Yeah. Yeah, yeah. It's awesome, man. I I I really love it. I'm uh I'm excited for you to start on your your podcast journey. I think it's really cool. Uh I'm sure you'll you'll do an amazing job with it. So um, John, give us a little insights if if people want to get involved in Insight Tracker um or they want to find out more about you, get in touch with you, where where do they do that?

Yeah, insight tracker.com is the site. Um I'm sure we can set up something for your listeners um and we can include that. Uh I'm JW Levitt, L-E-B-I-T-T on all forms of social. Just like to keep it easy. Um I tweet a lot, I'm on Instagram. Uh yeah, feel free to reach out.

Awesome. Awesome, man. Well, John, thanks for coming out and talking about the tech. Uh you know, keep us updated. And if you know when something big comes out, uh let me know. We'll get you back on and we'll talk about it again. Sounds like a plan. Thanks for having me on. Right on. All right, have a good one. Hey fitness fans, don't leave yet. It's your host, Eric Malzone, and I have a quick favor to ask. Actually, three favors. So, number one, if you're a fan of our show, I ask you to do something that takes under three minutes. Go to iTunes, please, and subscribe to our show. Please, please, please. It means so much to us. It's so important. And then give us a favorable review. We would really, really appreciate it. And uh, I can't tell you how much it means and helps us out. So I know it takes two minutes of your day, and uh it means a lot to us. So please do that. Number two, go to our YouTube channel, our fitness marketing alliance, and uh please subscribe to our YouTube channel there. Number three, if you like this episode or any of the episodes that we've released, share it on social. That's huge, that's a big deal for us. And when we put a lot of work into these episodes uh trying to give you great actionable content uh for the fitness industry. So that would mean a lot. And that's it. So we have some big plans coming up for the show. I'll be talking about that in the next couple episodes. But thank you so much for listening. It means so much. And uh if you have any questions, please reach out to me. I'd love to hear from everybody. Eric, E R I C at Fitness Marketing Alliance.com