Ryan Webber of Bootcamp Blueprint - The Business of Bootcamps

What's up, cats and kittens? This is Eric, Future of Fitness Podcast, Fitness Marketing Alliance, and this is episode number 19. I get to talk to Ryan Weber. So Ryan owns CrossFit Eternal in Concord, North Carolina. And he is also one of the founders of Bootcamp Blueprint. So in this episode, we talk about the business of Boot Camps and why you should consider adding it to your program offerings at your facility or starting one on your own. It's a great business, it's great revenues. And in his what he's done with his business is he's taken the whole design and a lot of the top parts of it that consume your time outside of actually coaching the classes, and they bundle that for you, and it's an ongoing service. So he's now scaling that business in a big way. And there's a lot of really cool business lessons and ideas that you can grab from this. So I hope you enjoy it. And I would be remiss if I didn't mention that this episode is brought to you by the machine, the Fit Pro Edition RO. So great news, everybody, full stack digital marketing agency service is now available to the everyday fitness professional. So what is a machine? Machine is a periodized marketing system. And it is based on decades of fitness industry experience and Google predictive analytics. So it is designed to deliver ROI in 90 days. Absolutely. But it's so much more. After the 13-month program, every client machine will have an automated and evergreen marketing system. And it choreographs all the aspects of digital and traditional marketing. So we're talking about email funnels, we're talking about co-branding with local businesses, we're talking about getting your reviews set up, we're talking about pay-per-click advertising, Facebook and Google AdWords, search engine optimization, social media content marketing. I can go on and on and on. There's a lot to it. So get off the cycles of crash diet marketing. It's way too prevalent in our industry. And finally learn how to automate your marketing and lead generation the right way. The end goal is what you really wanted when you started entrepreneurial freedom. So if you're interested, go to fitnessmarketingalliance.com, go ahead and book a consultation, and we'll have a short conversation and we'll talk if it to find out if it's the right thing for you. So without further ado, let's get on to the show. Episode number 19 with Ryan Weber of Bootcamp Blueprint. Hi everybody, this is Eric, Fitness Marketing Alliance and the Future of Fitness Podcast. And uh today I have a great pleasure of talking to Ryan Weber. So, Ryan, thank you for coming on. This is um he's the owner of CrossFit Eternal, and he is also uh one of the founders or the founder of Bootcamp Blueprint. So um, Ryan, welcome. Thank you. I appreciate it. I'm excited. Cool. Yeah, we're excited to have you, man. Um I I like to ask people just give a little background when they come on the show. I guess, you know, for lack of a better term, what's your fitness story? How did you get into fitness? How did you get into where you are now? And yeah, kind of give us the reader's digest version of all that.

Yeah, I got a long story, honestly. Um, so I began, I played college football. Um, one of my roommates was a running back, probably the best athlete I've ever met in my life. Um, and one summer he came back and he was like, dude, how are you so ripped? And he's like, Oh, I started this thing called CrossFit. You know, I just kind of did it, it sounded fun. And he was telling me some of the workouts, and I'm like, that's silly. Like, there's no way a four-minute workout is good for you. Like, it's just not gonna be I'm I'm better than that, basically. So, you know, two more years pass, and I play, I finish out my playing career. I'm uh I'm now coaching high school football and working as a teacher, and another one of my friends from high school was doing CrossFit, and I'm looking at his pictures online, and he's getting bigger and more muscles. And you know, he actually competed in regionals um in the mid-Atlantic, and I'm like, what is this guy doing? Like, how is he getting so fit? And uh so he came home, he was at uh University of Chapel Hill, and he came home for Christmas break, and him and I got together. I said, Let me try this thing that you're doing. I have access to the school, you can come over, come do workouts. So I actually started in the gym of the high school that I coached at. Um and so yeah, our first workout was Fran. Um I think I was about 745. I did uh all of the thrusters unbroken. I think I did about sets of two, one strict pull-ups, and that's about all I could handle. And I quickly realized I needed to go to an affiliate. Um, so I found the closest affiliate. Um, I stayed there for about three or four months, but it was a new affiliate. The the coaching wasn't as good because they were new and getting started, they didn't really know what was going on. And then I found CrossFit Eternal, um, went over there, started working out. Um, there were some very good athletes that CrossFit Games athletes were here and kind of got into the team atmosphere. And for me, playing football, team atmosphere was great. Um fast forward three or four years, I coach, I purchased the facility, now I'm owning it. Um, you know, with that all in there, at some point I was an intern for NASCAR team, was thinking about opening my own facility to train pit crew members and sport performance because that was my background, and then CrossFit owning gym kind of fell into my lap, and I've been doing it ever since.

Awesome. Yeah, it makes sense now that you're a football player because I think I've seen some social media media videos of you uh moving some big weight. Didn't you just snatch like 300 or something like that?

Yeah, so uh I did the grid league thing when that was when that was a thing, um, just because I'm big and large and I randomly snatched 300 for the first time in like two years a little bit ago, um, I think last week or two weeks ago, and it it's been a long time and it just kind of surprised me because I was just in my class. Yeah, well, that would surprise me too.

Um, that's a huge number. Awesome. Well, that's good. That's great background. Um I'm curious, you know, when you you you ventured now, you you've had your gym for four years, as we were talking previously. Um and now you're starting um or you have started boot camp blueprint. And I have a whole lot of questions for you on the business of boot camps. Um they seem to be they've always been popular, right? But they seem to have a resurgence right now for some reason. Maybe uh you can either tell me I'm wrong or right. But how how do you actually define boot camp? Do you have a definition for it?

So I don't call my program at my facility boot camp. Um and you know, and my whole not my thought, the general idea of a boot camp for other people is what you're doing outside in a park. It's all bodyweight stuff, and it's more of the rah-rah cheerleader. Um, I define what we do is more of coaching for general fitness. We're trying to improve core and conditioning. So we still have progressions, we still have foundational movements, very similar to CrossFit. They're all functional movements, but my main focus for boot camp is core strengthening and conditioning. Okay.

How did you so tell me the evolution of of Boot Camp Blueprint? How did this whole thing start? How did you get to where you are now?

Um, I had a lot of failures. So we started our boot camp um about two years ago at my facility, and that it was out of a necessity or a need. Um, so we just started polling the members and and really just diving into why are people canceling their memberships, why are they not signing up to our gym? And we pretty much found three reasons. It was time, money, or um scared of the barbell or intimidation for weightlifting. Um, you know, typically your general person that comes in the doors, they say they want to tone up, they want to sweat, they want to look good, and that's great for a bootcamp program, but CrossFit can do that, but then the other things that are with CrossFit, they don't necessarily align with what we can do with boot camp. Um, so you know, we just kind of developed that need and niche, and so we said, you know what, we're going to start this program. Started the program. I ran it as CrossFit Light, and I did our CrossFit workouts without a barbell, and it was terrible because they didn't want that. Um so we kind of evolved it over the years, and now it adds a lot of your traditional boot camp movements. We do a lot of mountain climber type stuff, body weight stuff, but then we also do thrusters. We also do um, you know, a lot of rowing and biking and um slam balls and a lot of your general functional fitness movements from CrossFit, but then we also add in the general boot camp movements that are kind of getting the heart rate of it.

Okay. Great. And you was so tell me now, how has this evolved into what you've done now? How are you starting to scale this out to to more fitness professionals and gym owners?

Yeah, so what we kind of found is people didn't know what the heck bootcamp was, and I didn't want them to have the same problem as me as programming CrossFit Lite. If you want to offer CrossFit Lite, fantastic, offer that, but then also offer bootcamp for those people that want that. Um, and so rather than having the two years of making problems with your programming, um, I was able to just kind of condense our programming into more of like a package so your class is already laid out for you with your warmup, then mobility, and then a pre-workout warm-up for your coach to kind of analyze the the movements of the athletes before we work out, then we do the workout, then there's a cool down at the end. Rather than you trying to figure out what those movements should be and are, we've already kind of done it for you, and now I can give it to multiple gyms. It doesn't matter if it's a CrossFit gym or a you know, uh just a Golds gym that wants to offer a boot camp, like it's things that you can do to implement to start a program from scratch.

Okay. One of the questions I that comes to mind for you, Ryan, is you know, probably you started this the the quote-unquote bootcamp or CrossFit light to get more clients into your CrossFit gym, right? Or into your gym in general. How has that changed? Is this become like a major revenue stream for you that you see as a separate entity, or is it still something that's that's you know here to bring people into onto a different path?

It's a little of both, but now it's its own separate entity. Um and so I have people come to our facility only for we call it reboot, our reboot program. Um they don't ever want to touch CrossFit, and you know, it has its own program director that manages that program. Um, they have their own separate events, they have their own separate little community. Um, we do things as the gym with the gym as a whole, but then we also have that separate for just the reboot people or just CrossFit. Um, and it it's kind of evolved into its own little gym within our gym.

So would you say that there is like a specific like avatar or specific you know, fitness professional or gym owner that you think is like the ideal situation to start a boot camp?

Um typically areas that are gonna have more stay-at-home moms are gonna do really, really well with boot camps. Um, so generally places where there's a higher family or suburban area where you're just gonna have more women um that are are ready to kind of come in and test what the uh you know, test what the waters are for functional fitness, but don't want to do CrossFit because it's scary.

Yeah, I mean I've after owning a gym for such a long time, and I've done my own little renditions of of quote unquote boot camps and things like that, but the uh there's a high intimidation factor, right? Exactly. I don't know if it's necessarily I I want to say it's more involved around the barbell than any.

That's all it is. You know heavy weightlifting scary. Uh it shouldn't be. I mean, if you have the proper coaching and all that, it's it's very nice, but it's scary for most people. So, you know, we uh we we just take that fear out of it and we do a lot of the CrossFit movements and a lot of the boot camp movements that they've probably done in the park at some time before, and so it kind of eases that tension.

Cool. So, Ryan, without giving too much away, what what steps can you share in in setting up you know a boot camp in someone's gym? You know, like from coaching to program to pricing to marketing, you know, all those things.

Yeah, so um, you know, probably the best thing that I usually tell people is ask your former members. Um, they left your gym for a reason, and a lot of the time it's come to money or time or scared of the barbell or were got hurt because of heavy weightlifting. And so this is a great program that you can start to kind of get them back in the door, um, get them back in your facility, tell them about how we're focused on core and conditioning rather than the stuff that they left for. The time aspect, well, I I run it as a 45-minute class because I I don't see the need to do longer than like 30-minute workouts that are pretty high intensity, you know. Um if you kind of take a warm-up and a mobility at the beginning, a little cooldown at the end that gives you 15 minutes, and then the 30 minutes is kind of the meat and potatoes in the middle. Um so there's a little less time factor there that typically if you're doing a 6 a.m. class, now it's six to six forty-five rather than at seven o'clock, and it's like, oh, you know, at 6.45 I can get back home and shower and go back to work, but at seven I can't do that. Um, so it kind of helps with that. And then as far as the money is concerned, because it's 45-minute classes, I generally um advise people to charge just a little bit less. And the only reason is because it's it's less time. So, you know, I do 75% of what my CrossFit membership is, is how much our boot camp is. And now we've added a lower, it's not a lower value, but a lower price point based on the amount of time that we're we're coaching. Still the coaching's the same, still the the amount of equipment's the same, not not entirely the same, but you know, you still have pieces of equipment. But now when you're able to explain it, it's like, well, it's the same exact coaching as our CrossFit, it's just less time. That's how we have a less price point.

And do you also offer a nutrition component with it, or is that additional?

Uh it would be an additional um how I run it. Now we've done uh challenges where you can do a six-week boot camp and have the nutrition component in it. Um, anybody that enters our gym gets a very simple nutrition packet so they can learn on their own. But if they want to do more of like that individualized coaching, obviously you can add that with a nutritionist or other other programs as well. Cool.

And then how how about marketing? How have you how have you creatively marketed the the programs that you have?

Yeah, the the boot camp's challenging um because it's a different avatar for CrossFit. Um, so now you're starting to think about what are these people looking for? What are their buzzwords? You know, when someone's coming to CrossFit, they want a little bit more competition, they want a little more camaraderie. Um, and that's the people that come to our CrossFit classes. Now, boot camp, they're probably scared. So typically I'm asking questions: are you scared of XYZ? Um, are you intimidated by XYZ? Um also we're trying to um, you know, play to their buzzwords that they come in and ask of, I'm trying to tone up. Are you trying to tone up? Are you trying to burn fat? Are you trying to lose a few extra pounds? Are you trying to cut down a couple inches? You know, things that we know that they just need to move are gonna help them, but it it's resetting your mind of what is a boot camp person looking for versus what is CrossFit. It's it's not gonna be as uh, you know, it's more smiling, it's more high-fiving. Um, you know, it's more just having fun with with very uh you know lightweight work movements and and kind of the pictures and and diagrams of what you're using.

Cool. Yeah, it sounds like uh it sounds like marketing one-on-one. Yeah, it is. Just understand your client, know what they want. Uh we talk about it constantly. So, you know, the uh it seems to me, and this is coming from a a digital marketing agency, which is very crazy, but you know, it seems like the boot camp uh you know market is is fairly competitive. You know, is there any ways that you differentiate what you offer or what your um are they affiliates, the the people that you work with or the other gyms that you work with? Or what do you call them?

Currently we have a lot of affiliates. So a lot of uh CrossFit gym owners that are trying to add an extra revenue stream to their gym.

Okay. How do you differentiate what you guys do from maybe some other boot camps in the area? And this is, you know, I come from Santa Barbara, California. There is boot camps everywhere, right?

Yeah. So honestly, our biggest boot camp competition would be the ones that are actually coaching. Um, so ones that have a facility that have um, you know, think about CrossFit. Why are we different from regular gyms? It's constantly varied functional movements with a coach, um, making sure that you're staying safe and progressing at the correct pace. We do the same thing with boot camp. It's still constantly varied functional movements with a coach progressing at the same safe pace. However, you know, that's how we differentiate ourselves from boot camps. You know, it's it's the same quality of coaching, nothing changes. It's just the movements change.

So eventually you want to keep these people long term, right? Are your how how long do your boot camps go for? Are they ongoing or do you do like periods?

Mine's ongoing. So you know, at our facility, I have uh 17 boot camp classes a week, and it's just a monthly membership.

Okay. Okay, great. Yeah, because you know, my thought was, and where I was going with this, is that most when people think boot camp, they think six weeks, right? Four weeks, six weeks, eight weeks, something that they know they can probably finish and then go do something else.

And that's one of the ways that we grew our boot camp, is we started with the six weeks and then said, hey, we have this class that's ongoing. Would you like to continue coming? You finished the six weeks, fantastic. Don't stop now. Here's what you can keep doing.

Okay. So that was my next question. Is that how do you get people transitioned from a six-week mentality, right, to a lifelong mentality? Is there anything that just kind of happened, or is there anything that you prove you kind of guided people down a path?

Yeah, so um, a big thing is kind of goal settings. So at the beginning, what was your goal? Okay, great. Before and after testing, here's what you did in six weeks. Imagine if we extrapolated this over 12 months, you know, five years. What could the progress actually be? You know, most people come in, they're saying, I want to lose 50 pounds. Fantastic. Our goal is gonna be 10 pounds in six weeks, depending on their body size and type and all that. But, you know, they lose eight pounds because that's actually realistic. And we start looking at the numbers. Well, you gained two pounds of muscle, you lost 10 pounds of fat, you lost eight total pounds to your body. That was six weeks. What happens if we do another six weeks? What happens if we do six months and you just have that constant change over time and your body is able to progressively move with a program rather than just shock it for six weeks, then you go back to where you restarted?

Yeah, that's great. Uh so you mentioned uh testing. What kind of testing do you do for these people?

I have a in-body, so I love to do the body fat scan. Um, you know, being able to actually see where your muscle is gaining and losing, where your fat's gaining and losing, how much of each that you're you're gaining, you know, what if the the scale changed zero pounds? But you start really diving down in the numbers, and it's like, well, look at there, you actually lost four pounds of fat and gained four pounds of muscle. You know, you look completely different, but you didn't lose a pound on the scale, which is fantastic. You know, it's not always about that number on the scale, it's about the number of the body fat percentage that you have. So, you know, just getting them to have that mindset shift of it's not the number, it's more of how healthy I am.

Yeah, that's awesome. And anybody who doesn't have an in-body or something similar, I highly suggest it. And uh I know I was concerned with the price tag when I first bought mine, and then I realized I quickly monetized it.

It's paid off hands down with our nutrition program and by far just selling ongoing six-week challenges where it's like, look at your progress. What happens if you actually continue going?

Yeah, well, that's fantastic. So I know that you uh I think you got in front of me with some creative Facebook marketing, right? I did. So tell me, like, is there any other thing? And once again, without giving too much away, you know, people are people are always dying of Facebook marketing is super hot right now. Um it's we see it as one piece of the pie as a very powerful piece of the pie. But you know, give us some insight into how you're how you're spreading the word, how you're doing things uniquely.

Yeah, so uh my Facebook marketing to you was free. Um I I literally went into a group and so his Facebook marketing was free. Okay, curious. Yes, yes. Um I like I said, I went into a group um and I uh I looked up anybody that had um commented on any post that I had written about boot camp. And So anybody that liked it or commented. And so I had made a YouTube video that I was going to put on my Instagram page for Bootcamp Blueprint. And so basically the the answer or the the the Instagram post was why start a boot camp. And so, you know, basically I was telling people of added revenue streams, diversify, um, that type of stuff. And I literally just wrote up a little text of, hey, didn't know if you would start your boot camp yet. Um, if you are interested, here's why you should start one. And I sent it to everybody in a direct message on Facebook that had commented or liked about a boot camp post. And the return rate on that was probably 70% of the people either said thank you or started dialogue. And you know, now it's turned into I'm sitting here on this podcast, and you know, I've had many, many of those people purchase our programming now. And this was when I had zero customers. And so now we've got gyms that are monthly following our programming just because of that, just taking action and doing that.

Yeah, it's it's it's awesome. I I love that. It's so simple. Yeah, yeah. And I it's it's funny because we've talked about it with my business partner too. Like, what happens if you actually just pick up the phone and call somebody now? Like they're like they'd be so shocked. Or even better yet, write a handwritten letter and send it to somebody. What are they gonna do?

They're gonna they're gonna find it. Like these that we're sending out to our members?

Yeah, exactly. Yeah, you know, I I I love it because you know the fundamentals of marketing haven't changed. We just have more tools and we can do different things now. But the it's the same. It's just, you know, you have to know who you're trying to reach. And if if you have a list, you work that list and then you just keep going and going and going, and you just have more options now. So I kudos, man. That's great.

Yeah, and you know, one of the other things that I have done in our current boot camp, I I had to hire somebody. I had to hire somebody to take over the program. It got too big. I was basically handcuffing the program because I was trying to oversee CrossFit and Bootcamp and Bootcamp Blueprint and all of this. So I literally just hired somebody like last week and was like, you need to run bootcamp, and your whole job is to basically check in with everybody. Um, basically cultivate the community and the culture of that. And so I'm now able to, one of my my tasks, my my jobs as the owner, I send two videos out every single day, 15-second videos on the platform that I think I can reach this person the best. And it's just a thank you, how are you doing? How can I help? You know, whatever's whatever I can think of in their life. But now I'm able to reach two members every single day just by sending a quick video. And you know, the response rate is like, oh my God, I didn't know you were thinking of me. It's so easy, like you said. Yeah, it's well, you know, it's simple, it's not easy.

You still have to put it in your work, right? Uh so tell me exactly if you know if I'm if I'm a fitness professional and I'm listening to you and I want to get involved with Bootcamp Looproom, what is it exactly that I would get as a fitness professional or a gym owner?

Yeah, so I'm uh currently what we have, we have four week blocks. So you sign up, it's bootcamp uh bp.com. You you go there, you click on the the sign up thing, um, you get a four-week block of six days a week of programming. So the programming is gonna have your warm-up down to the second. It's gonna have a mobility piece, it's going to have a pre-workout warm-up, um, and then it's gonna have a workout and coach's notes at the bottom so you know what kind of a the goal is of that workout. Um each month we progressively add four to eight new movements so you can slowly build your boot camp without adding a bunch of equipment. So month one is pretty watered down, um, but it's also very effective as far as training. It might be kind of boring, but you can also keep people intrigued by saying, hey, wait for month two, we've got some more equipment that we're gonna be adding. But for you as an owner, you're not having to add a bunch of equipment at the end at the beginning. So it's using, I think the only thing that you probably should have is slam balls. Outside of that, it's your normal everyday gym equipment in a CrossFit facility or a functional fitness facility. And so month two will add a little bit new movements to keep it exciting. That way your coaches aren't having to learn a bunch of new terminology and movements. Month three will add a few new movements and maybe another piece of equipment. So now you're not having to spend a bunch of money without making money. So after three months, you should have made a little bit of money from your boot camp. You can reinvest it for month four and five and six, so on and so forth. So, you know, we're progressively challenging, making the workouts more challenging, progressively adding new movements to keep it exciting, and also make sure that your coaches aren't learning too many movements at once and not being able to really coach the foundations before they move on.

How how how long do you think, let's say, on a weekly basis, it would take for a gym owner to do everything that you guys provide up front?

Well, it takes me about 10 hours a week to write, or 10 hours to write the month's programming. Okay. Um, so weekly, if you're doing it the right way with coaches' notes and all of that, and also demo videos like we provide for your coaches, at least two to three hours a week. Yeah, and what's your price point? Uh $199 a month. Yeah, that's for four weeks. No brainer. Yeah, I mean, you're you're looking at less than one person a week, uh, or really like two members a month for the most part for uh what typically I I know what the price point of people's boot camps are, generally around $100 a month. So you're looking at two members and and you've paid for your programming for the entire month. If you can't make back uh two members in 10 hours of your free time, then you've got some other issues that you need to work on. Yeah, better start writing the handwritten letters, right?

Uh so where do you see uh where do you see your business in in two years?

Where do you see it going? In two years, my goal is to have a team around us and we're doing multiple um, you know, coming in and actually going to your facility and helping you start your boot camp. Um, a lot of people don't understand the marketing or they have multiple, multiple questions of how to get it going. And we're gonna have basically an incubation phase. So, you know, four weeks to on-ramp your boot camp. Um, the last few days we're gonna have somebody actually on the facility to make sure that your coaches know exactly what's going on, uh, make sure that you're ready to launch it, make sure that you have everything prepared and you know, really walk you along the steps of starting this whole new program so it's beneficial right from the start rather than I start it, I have zero members, and my fingers are crossed that it's gonna work out. We want you to be able to start with 25, 30, 40 members, and from day one, you're already profiting.

What what kind of support do you guys currently with your current model, how what kind of support do you guys offer? Are you talking to gym owners once a month, or is it just the programming, or how does it work?

Uh, before I was on the call, I was sending out a survey for all of my gym owners that are on the program just to see what they think. You know, typically we're gonna always be able to tweak and alter and make things better. Um, so I just want to see what their members are thinking about the program, what their coaches feel about the program, how easy is it? So I can always upgrade the implementation. But when you receive each month, you're gonna get all of your new movements in a demo video. Um, so you can look at them and watch them. Um on our Instagram page, I always post a lot of or I try to post a lot of coaches' notes and and reasoning behind different movements, so then the coaches can take that and explain it to the uh the members. That way the members are always benefiting and see the value in having that coach.

Awesome. Um what percentage, just out of curiosity, what percentage of your total like monthly uh net income or gross revenue is the boot camp now? Like what percentage of your business is boot camp?

Currently it's about a quarter. So about 25% of all of our revenue comes from boot camp.

Yeah, that's that's a nice, that's a considerable revenue stream.

So uh one year ago it was about 1%. Okay.

Yeah, so you've seen some growth. Yeah. We've seen some growth. Uh so Brian, if people want to get involved with you or they want to test out your service, or if they just want to straight up sign up, how do they how do they get a hold of you?

Yeah, bootcampbp.com. Um, you go there and you can always find me on Facebook or Instagram. Um we've got the bootcamp blueprint bootcamp blueprint Instagram page, we've got bootcamp blueprint Facebook page, or you can just find me on Facebook and I'm always answering questions.

Awesome. You guys, this is Ryan Weber. We s with CrossFit Eternal and uh Bootcamp Blueprint. And then Ryan, I appreciate your time. It's awesome what you guys are doing. I have a feeling you're gonna make uh a lot of fitness professionals a lot of money. So awesome. Yeah that's the goal. Thank you. Hi, brother. Talk to you soon. Thank you for listening to this episode of the Future of Fitness podcast and webinar series. Uh, we're working really hard here to keep great content coming out, and we'd like to express our back to you by offering you a free seven-day marketing craft course. So for text, if you go to fitnessmarketingalliance.com forward slash free f and you enter the promo code Titmark F-I-T-M-A-R-K, you can claim without it. No way, you can text us. So you can text the phone number 805619550 and you text the word Titmark F-I-T-M-A-R-K. So thank you. Keep listening, go find the offer at a ton of value. And if you ever want to get a hold of me, or if you have suggestions for guests, topics, or anything else, or if you just want to ask a question, uh I always respond. You can reach me at Eric E R I C at DismarkingAliance.com. And keep listening. We have a lot more coming down the pipe, and we'll make sure that we're keeping the value great for you guys. And farewell until next time.