Jeff Zwiefel - Life Time's Miora: An Elegant Longevity Offering

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[00:02:22] Jeff Zwiefel, welcome to the Future of Fitness, my friend.

[00:02:25] Good morning, Aaron.

[00:02:26] Great to be here.

[00:02:27] Yeah, it's a pleasure.

[00:02:28] And you and I had the opportunity to catch up at the New York event Beyond Active Americas,

[00:02:34] uh, earlier this year.

[00:02:36] And, uh, we connected for another interview on Athlete Tech News with Eddie Hertzman and,

[00:02:40] um, you know, got to know you and your story.

[00:02:43] And, uh, you know, I've, I've listened to and read a lot of things about you over your career,

[00:02:49] right?

[00:02:49] Especially with what you're doing at Lifetime in Miora.

[00:02:52] That seems to be catching a lot of headlines for, and for, for very good reason.

[00:02:55] Like, longevity is, uh, is kind of, I'm going to say it like the next evolution of our industry.

[00:03:02] You know, it's, it's, it's a grander perspective.

[00:03:05] It's more scientific.

[00:03:06] It's just different, but yet the same.

[00:03:09] And you've been around this industry for a very long time.

[00:03:12] Uh, you've evolved.

[00:03:14] Uh, you and I just had a great conversation about like this point in your career where

[00:03:17] you've kind of hit the mountaintop, right?

[00:03:20] You can see everything.

[00:03:21] The air is crisp, but you're looking to kind of diversify the purpose and things that you do.

[00:03:26] So I'm, I'm really interested in that, but we're going to dive a lot into longevity.

[00:03:29] Dive a lot into Lifetime's definition, how you guys are leading the market.

[00:03:34] Um, so buckle up people.

[00:03:35] There's a lot to talk about today.

[00:03:36] So Jeff, if you don't mind, just maybe give a, uh, a synopsis of your, your career within.

[00:03:43] I laugh because there, you've done so much.

[00:03:45] So give us a background and then we'll dive into, uh, the meat of it.

[00:03:49] I'm appreciative of the kind words and always, uh, remain, uh, very appreciative, uh, and

[00:03:57] humble around the opportunities that have been presented to me and the great people that

[00:04:02] I've had the opportunity to do it with.

[00:04:04] Um, because as you know, um, the fitness business is a people business and that people centric business

[00:04:12] that makes it successful.

[00:04:13] So in a nutshell, Eric looked great.

[00:04:17] Uh, I've been in the health, fitness, wellness, uh, nutrition space for the last 40 years.

[00:04:22] Um, last 25 years with Lifetime, um, the premier luxury resort, um, provider and, um, was so fortunate

[00:04:35] that I've been blessed to finish my career there as the chief operating officer and president of the organization.

[00:04:41] You know, I had been a part of growing that, uh, iconic world-class brand, um, with the maniacal focus on the member point of view, um, from

[00:05:06] the, uh, the CEO and president of the company.

[00:05:17] Um, the CEO and president we had 180 clubs.

[00:05:20] Um, you know, the revenue was 139 million in, uh, 1998 when I joined the organization and we, we finished at around 2.3 billion in revenue.

[00:05:32] And I think more importantly than anything, Eric, it's both the lives throughout my career that I've been able to impact and change.

[00:05:44] I started in this business as an exercise physiologist technically.

[00:05:49] I started as a personal trainer in the business and loved changing lives.

[00:05:56] The rewards that I was able to see from helping people get healthier and get fitter have been amazing.

[00:06:06] And that has never stopped in my journey.

[00:06:10] And I've counseled and coached a lot of professional executives in this business that are moving up through the ranks.

[00:06:18] And it does get harder because, for me, you get more disconnected from the actual client.

[00:06:28] But you've got to recognize your ability to impact these lives on a macro level.

[00:06:35] And those rewards are significant.

[00:06:38] So the people's lives we've been able to change over the years, the millions of lives, but also the team members and employees.

[00:06:46] We grew to about 35,000.

[00:06:49] We're at about 38,000 team members at Lifetime now.

[00:06:53] And, you know, it's just a phenomenal team of passionate, committed people to help people improve living better and living longer.

[00:07:03] So I'm just proud of what we've been able to accomplish.

[00:07:07] You know, I've worked in hospital-based clubs.

[00:07:09] And I spent a decade of my career as vice president of product development at NordicTrack that was based here in Minneapolis at the time.

[00:07:17] Learned a ton there through that stint.

[00:07:21] And, you know, Lifetime has been an amazing journey.

[00:07:24] I ran personal training in that business, Group X.

[00:07:27] I ran our internal certification department called Lifetime University.

[00:07:32] All great learnings and proving ground for me to ultimately step in the role that I was in.

[00:07:40] Yeah, amazing.

[00:07:41] And I have never stepped foot into a lifetime yet just by nature of where I've lived.

[00:07:47] And I know it's shocking to me.

[00:07:49] I'm very excited.

[00:07:50] But I've learned a lot over the last year and a half, specifically because I started doing these quarterly reports on this podcast with Juliette Sturet and Alex Alaministiano.

[00:08:00] And we do it every quarter.

[00:08:02] We go over earnings reports of public companies.

[00:08:04] And I think both Juliette and I are the same.

[00:08:06] We've both been around the industry, both been coaches for a long time.

[00:08:09] And as we go through these earning reports, we just start to earn more and more respect for Lifetime as a company.

[00:08:17] How well it's run, at least from the numbers.

[00:08:19] And Alex has really big insights as the former CEO of Town Sports.

[00:08:24] And I think it's really a shining example of how things can be done within our industry and how our industry can be taken very seriously if it's run correctly and how you guys promote from within.

[00:08:40] Like, Barham's been a leader of that company for a very long time.

[00:08:43] People like you have evolved within.

[00:08:45] And you see a lot of companies now, especially the few that are public, are always hiring from the outside and bringing in.

[00:08:51] And we're always talking about, like, how can we just keep evolving talent within our industry so that they can take over the next step versus going to get someone from Taco Bell, for instance.

[00:09:01] Right.

[00:09:01] So I really respect what you guys do there.

[00:09:04] And I want to give a lot of time here to Miura, especially.

[00:09:10] And I think something that after I talked to you is people realize it's gone through some iterations.

[00:09:15] What Miura is now isn't exactly what it was when it started.

[00:09:19] So maybe specifically talk about the background on that, how it's gotten to the point where it is now in 2024.

[00:09:24] Yeah, thanks, Eric.

[00:09:26] Right.

[00:09:26] Like with any idea, you know, a business concept, it many times is either the wrong time or poor execution.

[00:09:40] Right.

[00:09:40] Where either the market isn't ready for it or the business isn't ready to, you know, launch an initiative such as Miura.

[00:09:49] But, you know, as we have talked previously and many people don't know, but I think great leaders and great organizations have the confidence to be with humility and candor and transparency.

[00:10:05] And some of that transparency for us is to be bold enough to admit when we are wrong, when we failed and when we made mistakes.

[00:10:20] And those failures and those mistakes have been tremendous opportunities for us to learn and adapt and grow and change and pivot.

[00:10:29] And this example, right, that we discussed previously way back in 2016, 17, Lifetime, Brahm, I and the team really felt like there was an opportunity to really transform health care as the consumer knows it.

[00:10:48] And an absolutely, you know, beautiful idea of creating this integrated care model of a primary care doc and a registered dietitian and a personal training.

[00:11:01] An integrated holistic approach where that team would align and deal holistically with in a comprehensive manner with the patient's problems and concerns.

[00:11:17] So we hired 15, 16 different MDs at $300,000 each.

[00:11:24] We built out space and beautiful space in our clubs and spent a lot of money and invested time and energy in it.

[00:11:33] And, you know, the reality is, is that we were several degrees off in our thinking.

[00:11:39] And, you know, our customer wasn't prepared to look to Lifetime necessarily as the solution for their primary care needs.

[00:11:49] And so we ended up closing it up and writing off a significant amount of dollars and, you know, moving on.

[00:12:00] And since then, we've done a number of different things, right?

[00:12:03] We started a program called My Health Score that we offered to our members, which rolled up metrics that was unique to Lifetime on a scale of 0 to 100, inclusive of body comp and lipid profiles and flexibility and strength.

[00:12:21] And, you know, really tried to encourage people to understand more of their overall health.

[00:12:28] We brought a program to the B2B market attempting to affect health care costs for employers, right?

[00:12:37] And we called that My Health Check.

[00:12:38] And this My Health Score was an integral part of that.

[00:12:42] We developed massive trailers to bring around to corporations to address and do the assessments and the health scoring that we wanted to do.

[00:12:55] All of that was necessary and valuable learnings for us.

[00:13:01] Fast forwarding today, Eric, we're, you know, about 18, 24 months ago, we embarked on this journey to launch Miora, as you've indicated.

[00:13:11] But I feel like it's also provide us with the ability to really laser in on where the right opportunity is for Lifetime, as we refer to it, Eric, as our right to win.

[00:13:24] And when you think about Lifetime, and we started to imagine this Brahmini, his nickname, of course, is BA, so I may use the BA reference periodically.

[00:13:35] He is a visionary, right?

[00:13:37] He's been an amazing visionary on the selection of our locations, the design of our facilities, the flow, the color scheme, all the millions of details, right?

[00:13:51] That come together to bring this experience that it does.

[00:13:56] So we started putting our heads together with this.

[00:13:59] And we recognized, of course, that Lifetime, right to win comes down to a couple of key factors.

[00:14:06] We have the iconic destinations all over the country, 180 of them.

[00:14:11] We have the square footage.

[00:14:13] Lifetime under roof has 17.2 million square feet across all of our locations.

[00:14:22] We have the traffic in our clubs.

[00:14:24] You know, we'll see over 111 million swipes in our clubs this year.

[00:14:30] So clearly, our members are active users, not a non-user model like some of the operators are.

[00:14:39] They have the discretionary income.

[00:14:41] You know, the average income of our members is extremely high.

[00:14:45] And they're already committed to spending on their own health.

[00:14:49] And they're highly educated around their own health.

[00:14:52] So all the – and we have the real estate that in many instances is underutilized in some of our clubs that can be easily converted.

[00:15:02] Because a lot of times the question that comes up is, is these outside of a lifetime?

[00:15:07] Are they within a lifetime?

[00:15:08] And for us, we want to build them in a lifetime so that the lifetime story continues to hold together, which is everything's conveniently located as a one-stop shop solution.

[00:15:22] You know, with our club connecting fitness to longevity and health outcomes.

[00:15:27] That's really the approach and the vision that we had with Miura.

[00:15:31] And the difference being technically that we didn't want to be in primary care.

[00:15:35] We knew that the consumer and our member would continue and should be continuing to seek out their primary care docs and the specialists for those kinds of needs.

[00:15:46] What we were looking to do was to take the consumer and the member where we couldn't before.

[00:15:52] And that is encompassing holistic approach in where we've had to traditionally end our ability to impact them within our personal training or our fitness programming.

[00:16:05] And now continue to extend them on from there.

[00:16:09] Because as you said, Eric, now more than ever, the customer's looking to live longer better.

[00:16:15] They're looking to, you know, feel good.

[00:16:18] They're looking to perform better and function better and live longer better.

[00:16:23] And that's really what I think it's all about.

[00:16:27] Yeah.

[00:16:28] Yeah.

[00:16:28] Amazing.

[00:16:29] And as you described that whole journey that you guys went through, I'd imagine it's such like a slap in the forehead, duh, aha moment.

[00:16:39] When you're like, wait a minute, we have everything we need right in front of us.

[00:16:43] We have the ideal consumer.

[00:16:45] We have the space.

[00:16:46] We have the operational capacity to do it all.

[00:16:48] Like it's, we don't have to build this completely new thing, right?

[00:16:52] That's right.

[00:16:53] And now all we really needed to do as part of our true north was establish Lifetime as the trusted and respected national brand in the longevity business.

[00:17:03] Yeah.

[00:17:03] You know, to establish us.

[00:17:05] And that, and that, that's easy to say.

[00:17:08] But that's very difficult to do, right?

[00:17:10] Like, like so many things that are worth it.

[00:17:13] Yeah.

[00:17:14] So what exactly is Muir for people who are listening and we're talking to industry folk, like how does it differ than a traditional lifetime offering?

[00:17:23] Yeah.

[00:17:23] It's a great question.

[00:17:24] And, you know, I'd start with saying that the essence of the idea really was this overwhelming problem that we know we have in society, right?

[00:17:35] All great ideas originate from solving fundamental problems in a very, you know, simple and frictionless, seamless way, elegant way.

[00:17:47] And Apple, as we all know, is a great example of doing that in so many ways in their ecosystem.

[00:17:52] So we think about that ecosystem.

[00:17:54] We translate that ecosystem to Lifetime.

[00:17:56] And, you know, what we've done is we've taken a platform called the Metabolic Code Foundationally that was created by our chief science officer, James LaValle, who's head of the American Academy of Aging, A4M.

[00:18:16] He's involved in the International Peptides Association as a co-chair.

[00:18:22] And I brought him in to help us start to create this model.

[00:18:27] We've taken his metabolic code, which creates a cloud-based algorithm that allows us to score the consumer's biometrics, i.e. their blood biomarkers, and rack and stack those in a simple red, yellow, green hierarchy.

[00:18:46] So we take you and do your blood work either on site through one of our phlebotomists or through Quest or LabCorp.

[00:18:56] Your blood comes back in 10 to 14 days.

[00:19:00] Additionally, we've got a symptomology report that's a very extensive understanding of how are you feeling?

[00:19:07] How are you performing?

[00:19:08] How's your sleep?

[00:19:10] Do you have brain fog?

[00:19:11] Do you not have energy?

[00:19:14] How are you recovering from exercise?

[00:19:16] All the factors that we know consumers are dealing with.

[00:19:20] We get the blood results back.

[00:19:22] We line those up with the symptomology.

[00:19:25] You sit down with one of our practitioners, and we go through the results of that.

[00:19:30] That is, by contrast, as you know, Eric, and many of your listeners will know, you go to your primary care doc,

[00:19:37] you might get 10 or 15 different blood biomarkers.

[00:19:40] Our most basic plan draws about 95 biomarkers to really understand deeply what's happening inside.

[00:19:49] For me, you know, I recently got my second lab results back.

[00:19:56] You know, my first results were extremely off on LDL particle size, homeocysteine levels, cortisol levels.

[00:20:05] And so it looks deep at all these different components, rack and stack that in the five different triads so that we can prioritize for the customer what's most important, right?

[00:20:18] Because it really can become overwhelming for the consumer.

[00:20:23] So we want to keep it extremely simple and figure out where we can get the quick wins.

[00:20:28] In that hour consult, we will begin to work on lifestyle behaviors, exercise, nutrition, how to manage stress, how to improve sleep.

[00:20:38] But we will also begin to understand what, you know, treatment maneuvers we want to try to put in place.

[00:20:46] Is it supplementation with nutritional supplementation?

[00:20:50] Is it in the area of hormones?

[00:20:53] Is it in peptides?

[00:20:55] Are we looking at IV therapies?

[00:20:58] The other thing that we've done within this space, within our location at downtown Minneapolis, we integrated recovery into it.

[00:21:10] So we've got what we call our dynamic stretch tables that becomes a space for our personal trainers to treat clients.

[00:21:17] We've got a number of different hydro massages in that space, cryo beds.

[00:21:25] We've got a nurse's lab, but then we've got our IV lounge.

[00:21:29] We also spared no expense by putting in electronic cryo, red light therapy beds, infrared saunas, hyperbaric chambers.

[00:21:40] We spared no expense.

[00:21:42] And then lastly, we have a full array of aesthetic services from female incontinence machines to laser hair removal and Botox.

[00:21:52] You name it.

[00:21:53] We spent $1.2 million on the aesthetics equipment at this one location.

[00:22:00] So again, as Brahm has always committed, we said if we're going to do this, we're going to do it right or not at all.

[00:22:07] And that's the lifetime way.

[00:22:09] And that if we were going to get into this business, it had to be accretive to the mothership brand.

[00:22:14] So the first checkpoint, Eric, has been that the customer experience has to be flawless.

[00:22:20] It has to actually be as good or better than someone would get within a lifetime.

[00:22:25] So we made sure from end to end that customer journey is tremendous.

[00:22:30] Follow-up and follow-through of the stages of the customer care within Meora from the time they're getting their blood work to the time they do that consult and that interpretation of their results to the follow-up every three to six months on redoing their blood work and coming back and seeing what their progress is.

[00:22:50] We'll connect an RD and a personal trainer as well to this client and making sure that we have a holistic plan.

[00:22:57] And then we'll help them advise them into various other modalities that might be helpful for them.

[00:23:03] So it was intended to be an integrated plan like we had way back originally.

[00:23:09] It's intended to be a comprehensive plan, not just addressed, you know, body composition or strength or flexibility or, you know, VO2 max.

[00:23:20] We are actually doing DEXA scans on all of our patients as part of this process because we're also seeing many of our clients that are seeking, as you know, GLP-1s.

[00:23:33] And we can get into that in a little bit later, but we want to make sure we address the entire approach of the consumer, not just one element.

[00:23:44] And that's one of the key differences that the limitations in the fitness business like I've always had is that we had to turn them over and ask them to go somewhere else.

[00:23:55] And as you know, Eric, now more than ever, the consumer's own health outcomes is in their own hands.

[00:24:02] And it's extremely hard for them to navigate the system and find the trusted, respected solutions that are scientific or evidence-based.

[00:24:13] And that, you know, leaves it up to chance for them.

[00:24:17] And we wanted to make sure we can, you know, be there for our customers and the consumers at large in this, you know, journey that they're undertaking now more than ever.

[00:24:28] Because we're seeing with the growth and the success of Peter Atiyah's and Andrew Huberman's and David Sinclair's and Brian Johnson, this has now become mainstream for consumers.

[00:24:41] They're just not looking to deal with sickness and illness like our traditional healthcare system does.

[00:24:48] They're looking for optimal health.

[00:24:52] Yeah, well said.

[00:24:54] And, you know, one of the questions, and I think you've kind of touched on, but we'll get real clear on it here is, you know, I was telling you one of my friends called me right before this, Spencer Tatum.

[00:25:03] And I was like, hey, Spencer, got to call you back.

[00:25:05] About to interview Jeff.

[00:25:07] And he's like, oh, I have got a question for him, right?

[00:25:10] So here's the question.

[00:25:12] Is how do we measure success here, right?

[00:25:15] You've measured, obviously, there's a lot of data that you pull in on people, a lot of biomarkers from, you know, DEXA to blood work to imagine there's a few other ones.

[00:25:23] That you guys are looking at.

[00:25:25] So how specifically is there a singular score that you're looking at that you guys kind of pulled in to almost gamify it for the client as far as longevity?

[00:25:34] So, yeah, how do you measure it?

[00:25:35] Because I think, and I want to add some more context to this question, and I'll get this from Jim Donnelly from Humanot.

[00:25:41] Restore is like, I think consumers need an immediate, I feel better, right?

[00:25:46] On top of the long-term longevity goal.

[00:25:50] Because, you know, if we're talking about how I'm going to feel 40 years from now, it's a tough thing to invest in.

[00:25:55] I want to feel better right now as well.

[00:25:56] So, yeah, how do we measure it for these people?

[00:25:58] How do we measure their success as we go forward?

[00:26:01] Yeah.

[00:26:01] You know, you're exactly right, Eric.

[00:26:04] The first step for us is, do they feel better?

[00:26:07] You know, is their day-to-day lives, from what they reported in that symptomology report, is that creating a significant improvement?

[00:26:19] And that's really what we're looking to achieve first, because, as you know, in any great behavioral modification model, if you're not addressing that as the foundation, then you're not going to get the adherence and the compliance and the retention that, candidly, that we are all seeking.

[00:26:40] And, you know, so then we go to the next level, which becomes those metrics and those triads within the metabolic code.

[00:26:52] Are we moving the needle on those key biomarkers that are necessary to know that we're changing, you know, your short-term and your long-term health outlook?

[00:27:05] What's so, I think, amazing and intriguing about this process on multiple different levels?

[00:27:13] On one side, Eric, a lot of people, I think, will have a myth about longevity that it's for old dogs like me.

[00:27:23] I'm 62 only that are worried about, you know, thank you, buddy, but that are worried about the back nine, if you will.

[00:27:33] But we're finding more and more the 28, 30, 32-year-old that's having problems with anxiety and stress, that can't sleep, that have reproductive health, you know, that aren't recovering well from training.

[00:27:48] These issues and problems are happening earlier than ever before.

[00:27:52] For folks that are reaching the 40s to 50s, they are starting to think about what the quality of life is going to look like.

[00:28:03] And what's so cool about this, I believe, is predicting five to eight years downstream what will inevitably happen based on our insights through this blood work if you don't change certain things about your lifestyle.

[00:28:19] So, I mean, we've all seen the recent study that showed now that aging is not a linear equation.

[00:28:27] There are key points at 44 and 60 where a tremendous amount of accelerated metabolic effects within your health change dramatically at those two inflection points.

[00:28:42] And that we know that if we start early, it is going to have a significant impact on accumulative implications for your long-term health.

[00:28:52] So, to answer your question, again, I reiterate, one, do you feel better?

[00:28:58] Are you sleeping better?

[00:28:59] Do you have less brain fog?

[00:29:01] Are you more alert during the day and having more energy?

[00:29:04] You know, right?

[00:29:05] Are you recovering better from training?

[00:29:07] Do you feel like you have less bloating and gut issues that you've been having, right?

[00:29:12] Because as we know, microbiome is becoming a huge issue for consumers right now and gut health.

[00:29:18] And so, we want to address those first, as you said, to get them the confidence and the belief that they're investing in the right thing.

[00:29:27] They're on the right road.

[00:29:28] And once we start to then present to them the changes in that retest of the blood biomarkers and that they're moving some of the key biomarkers that are putting them in a risky situation, maybe short and long-term, that's really where we're measuring success.

[00:29:46] And long-term, as you know, the flywheel of a successful business all comes back to, are we creating raving fans?

[00:29:56] Hey, friends.

[00:29:57] This episode of The Future of Fitness is proudly brought to you by TeamUp.

[00:30:00] Since launching in 2012, they've consistently had one mission.

[00:30:04] Facilitate the best customer experiences with the most cutting-edge solution for franchises, studios, gyms, and boxes.

[00:30:13] At its core, TeamUp is a tech solution for businesses looking to unlock their next phase of growth with the most reliable partner and technology on the market.

[00:30:23] Spanning over 4,000 clients in 40-plus countries, TeamUp has a vast global network with its roots right here in North America.

[00:30:30] Whether it's AI, new features, new partnerships, and new markets, TeamUp's sights are set on raising the bar of the industry to enable their customers to perform and operate at the highest level locally, nationally, and overseas.

[00:30:45] Powered by the most reliable APIs on the market, you can deliver premium customer experiences and scale your fitness enterprise with the strongest technological infrastructure our industry has to offer.

[00:30:56] Empower your staff, engage your members, and unlock your next chapter of growth with software design for you.

[00:31:04] Learn more at goteamup.com.

[00:31:06] That is G-O-T-E-A-M-U-P dot com.

[00:31:10] Are people loving what we're delivering, and are they sticking with it in growing?

[00:31:20] And that's been the lifetime formula of success.

[00:31:22] Our number one commitment started by BA has always been, as I said, this member point of view.

[00:31:28] So that's why it's been so important for us to first and foremost get this member journey really tightened down.

[00:31:37] So that when we begin, as we say, to replicate the Da Vinci, we want to replicate the master Da Vinci, not a bad version of it, as we roll it back out to 180 clubs.

[00:31:50] And that's really important.

[00:31:51] And then secondly, as you know, Eric, as a public health company, of course, it goes without saying.

[00:31:58] The financial KPIs and metrics must be there.

[00:32:01] The profit margin needs to be there.

[00:32:03] The revenue growth, you know, the EBITDA performance of the business needs to be there.

[00:32:08] And, you know, it needs to be accretive to the mothership.

[00:32:14] Yeah.

[00:32:14] Yeah, amazing.

[00:32:15] You know, I'm trying to think of the right way to ask this question.

[00:32:18] So out of everything that is Biora from the service offerings and the experience for the client,

[00:32:23] what percentage of that do you think is just, not just, but the traditional fitness offering, right?

[00:32:30] Like a personal training, nutrition combination.

[00:32:32] Because I think there's a lot of people in the industry who will say, yeah, longevity, we're just repackaging.

[00:32:37] You know, 90% of it is exercise and nutrition, right?

[00:32:40] And lifestyle.

[00:32:41] Well, I think what everybody needs to understand is, and I think most operators get this because we've been,

[00:32:47] I've been having, you know, a fair number of conversations about this same topic with operators from all over the country.

[00:32:54] And they're, you know, they're trying to figure out how they get into longevity space.

[00:32:59] What is their right to win in it based on their model?

[00:33:04] But also, as you can appreciate, how do they participate in this subsection of it in the GOP ones?

[00:33:10] But I think the only thing that I would say is comparable to the traditional model is the fact that, as, you know,

[00:33:24] folks that have been in the health and fitness and wellness industry for our entire professional career,

[00:33:29] undeniably better than anyone, we know the critical nature of connecting the dots between nutrition and supplementation through a trained professional like an RD,

[00:33:45] as well as the critical nature of a sound and well-designed and developed and periodized exercise program

[00:33:53] that is comprehensive components of cardiorespiratory, musculoskeletal, flexibility, and so on,

[00:34:01] to ensure that those are critical elements of this program and its foundation.

[00:34:07] You know, we would be naive and kidding ourselves, of course,

[00:34:12] at the brand that we are and what we stand for if we didn't build those as the foundational pieces of it.

[00:34:20] So thank you for bringing that up, Eric, as a point.

[00:34:24] And those are the only pieces that are running through this thing consistently that, you know,

[00:34:30] we've historically done and I think that others have done.

[00:34:33] Sure, we're doing body composition in this program, but we're doing it a little differently as well, as you know,

[00:34:41] as we said, because we know bone loss is becoming a much bigger issue than ever before,

[00:34:47] particularly in menopausal women.

[00:34:50] And it's something that we need to address, even in men.

[00:34:53] I'm 62.

[00:34:54] I'm a former athlete.

[00:34:56] I was a strength and conditioning coach as an exercise physiologist and a guy that's resistance trained for 40 years.

[00:35:03] When I do a bone scan, I see that one side asymmetrically, I've got a little bone loss.

[00:35:08] And I'm doing many, many overhead loading strength training exercises because I know as somebody that's been in this a long time,

[00:35:19] that is critical to continue to maintain and build bone mass.

[00:35:23] But even for me, I'm seeing some degradation.

[00:35:28] Yeah.

[00:35:28] Yeah.

[00:35:29] What sports did you play?

[00:35:30] I played collegiate football and I was a defensive back.

[00:35:34] And I went on to become a strength and conditioning coach at the high school professional and pro level.

[00:35:41] Worked as assistant with the Vikes for a little bit.

[00:35:43] And, you know, was a position coach in the defensive backs.

[00:35:49] Okay.

[00:35:50] Speedster.

[00:35:51] So, maybe this is probably a good question to bring in the GLP-1 conversation.

[00:35:55] But when you look at the menu of offerings that you guys have with Miora, what tends to be like the top three, two or three most deployed, right?

[00:36:07] I guess for the clients that you've seen so far.

[00:36:09] Yeah.

[00:36:10] You know, I think it starts, I think, with the reality that you and I both know, Eric, that's happened in our society today for a lot of reasons.

[00:36:21] With this, you know, metaflammation, as we refer to it as this chronic inflammation.

[00:36:28] Ninety-three percent of Americans today, ninety-three percent have suboptimized metabolic health.

[00:36:35] And a lot of that is correlated to our food supply, poor dietary habits, sedentary lifestyle, and being overweight and obese.

[00:36:44] We know the data there, 42 percent obese, 74 percent overweight.

[00:36:49] And, you know, what we've been doing, as you and I have discussed, isn't working.

[00:36:54] So, most of our folks are coming to us with this chronic inflammation.

[00:37:00] And the unfortunate tree and the limbs of this, you know, core issue, ranging from what we have talked about, hypertension to hyperlipidemia, you know, to swelling and bloating, to brain fog, to gut health.

[00:37:26] All of these things are interrelated.

[00:37:30] And within MIORA and within the metabolic code framework, we recognize that all these elements of the body are interconnected.

[00:37:41] And you can't deal with one without understanding and dealing with the body holistically.

[00:37:49] And unfortunately, as you well know, and we know in the industry, even with things like Rowe and other things, there's no way that that consumer is starting with a broad-based look of foundationally, inside-out, understanding what some of the core problems and root cause issues are for them.

[00:38:15] And they're using, you know, the shotgun approach to try to deal with it.

[00:38:20] And it may not be the appropriate solution.

[00:38:23] And that's really what I want to try to help people guard against, is try to sort through this thing and help navigate through all the pseudoscience and, you know, bad information that has existed, as we know, in our industry for so many years.

[00:38:41] And the blessing and the gift that we have are in this new mega trend of GLP-1s that can be a game changer for the industry and, I think, radically transform, you know, our obesity epidemic.

[00:38:59] But like any tool, it can be used right and it can be used wrong.

[00:39:05] And we want to really encourage people to figure out the right way to engage with it in the appropriate way.

[00:39:14] Yeah.

[00:39:15] Yeah, well said.

[00:39:16] I mean, it's overall, I am very bullish on GLP-1s.

[00:39:21] I just have, I think, like a lot of people, this existential angst about it because it's like we've allowed a lot of different industries to profit off making us sick.

[00:39:33] And now we have the pharma industry coming in and making mega, mega profits on trying to solve the problem.

[00:39:39] It never really should have existed in the first place, right?

[00:39:41] But it's where we are.

[00:39:43] And I think it was Ozenpic made or Novo made $28 billion.

[00:39:51] Yeah, Novo Nordisk and Eli Lillian.

[00:39:52] And 40% of that was Ozenpic.

[00:39:55] Yeah.

[00:39:56] That's incredible.

[00:39:56] And that's one of the reasons why, you know, in Miora, for example, of course, we're going to do all the things with our blood biomarkers and look at the comprehensive approach.

[00:40:07] And of course, we're going to, you know, add the critical elements of a high protein diet.

[00:40:13] And we're going to do the DEXA scans to understand body composition and do the resistance training necessary to, you know, offset the loss of lean body mass.

[00:40:23] But we're also going to, you know, titrate the dosages up.

[00:40:29] And once that individual has achieved their goal weight, we're going to titrate the dosages back down.

[00:40:35] And my thesis and the hypothesis is that we will find a way to treat customers where they don't have to be on this product for life.

[00:40:48] And we are also using other ingenious and very effective peptides like semerelin, as an example, that helps the body, you know, restore some of its natural processes in retaining lean body mass that work in concert with a product like this.

[00:41:10] You know, we use a product as well called CaloCurve that's been a highly researched New Zealand appetite suppressant product that can be used that allows people to get off.

[00:41:22] And it's not an accelerant, of course, to get off the GOP wants and live a normal life.

[00:41:28] So you don't have to spend the money on it and you certainly don't have to endure any of the negative side effects.

[00:41:35] Yeah, I guarantee a lot of people are going to Google that right now.

[00:41:40] I just listened to I don't know if you listen to this, but I think it was in October, September.

[00:41:44] Joe Rogan experience released an interview with the guy from Ways to Well.

[00:41:50] And it was it was super.

[00:41:52] I found it very inspiring, mainly because of, you know, his role.

[00:41:57] Like he's like it we can make this level of health care more accessible.

[00:42:02] Very Kelly.

[00:42:03] Kelly.

[00:42:03] Kelly.

[00:42:04] No, no, that is different.

[00:42:06] Yeah, it was different.

[00:42:07] Different gentleman.

[00:42:07] Bring him.

[00:42:08] Yeah.

[00:42:08] OK.

[00:42:09] Lose his name.

[00:42:10] But here's the point.

[00:42:12] And the question I was getting as like artificial intelligence can play a major role in taking all these data, like, you know, doing this testing and things like that.

[00:42:19] Like there's no reason why I can't do a lot of the work that a primary physician can, but they are too tied up in the current system to be able to do the work that they want to do.

[00:42:30] Right.

[00:42:30] Like that's kind of a fundamental problem.

[00:42:31] So when you guys look at artificial intelligence and I rarely get a conversation on this podcast that doesn't touch on AI now.

[00:42:38] How do you see that playing a role within the offerings that you guys provide at Muir specifically?

[00:42:43] Well, I think you're exactly right.

[00:42:45] I mean, we know that there's two reasons why we're doing, you know, such a comprehensive intake on our new patients.

[00:42:54] One, to make sure that we do a comprehensive look at their overall health.

[00:43:01] Two, that we make sure that we can customize that program to this specific individual.

[00:43:06] When you think about the broad range of analysis that we're doing from the biomarkers to body comp to blood pressure, you know, we will also be offering and adding in time things like the Jonah microbiome testing.

[00:43:25] You know, we will be offering, you know, we will be also doing brain taps in the future and, you know, adding components to look at capillary health as well.

[00:43:40] And I believe that AI, as you mentioned, will create a mechanism to seamlessly integrate and serve up all this data in a way for the consumer first and the practitioner to ensure that we can really understand and synthesize this data quickly and easily.

[00:44:01] And most importantly, I think for the advancement of the longevity category, begin to really validate and prove the treatment protocols so that we can continue to rapidly improve the outcomes.

[00:44:17] And again, continue to bring that forward because the power, as you know, Eric, will be in each one of these patient results and these outcomes.

[00:44:28] And the ability to predict a treatment protocol with the anticipated outcomes over time.

[00:44:36] So AI, I think will enable our ability just to expedite all of this in a very efficient way that we've never known was possible before.

[00:44:47] Yeah. And that's, you know, the accessibility component of it, because I think when people hear the price tag and I've heard numerous things, you can probably clarify here in a minute of like $40,000 additional to do something like Miura.

[00:44:58] Right. A lot of people clutch their pearls and they're like, that's, you know, that's for the rich. And I'm like, well, okay, sure. Maybe. I mean, it's the cost of a car.

[00:45:07] Yeah.

[00:45:08] I don't know. I mean, it's not that unaccessible, but it's going to get much lower.

[00:45:12] See that like lifetime, Eric, the reason we got into it that I hadn't really talked about because, you know, we don't really talk about price and we probably should be more open about it.

[00:45:25] We want to democratize the access to longevity because as we said earlier, we all know it's not for the uber rich anymore.

[00:45:34] It's for everyone. So to get into the game at lifetime, yes, you pay your base club membership.

[00:45:40] You'll pay $499 or $800 for the 95 panel blood work or the more extensive premium panel at $800.

[00:45:51] You'll pay $149 or $249 a month, $149 or $249 a month for access on a monthly basis on top of your membership to the Miura program.

[00:46:05] So it's very, very affordable for the average member or consumer to have access to this program.

[00:46:12] And that was our idea. I mean, we're not interested in 1% or 0.01% of the marketplace.

[00:46:19] Lifetime is interested in making this a large part of our membership contingency.

[00:46:25] We know that we can impact more of our members' lives.

[00:46:28] We know that we can create more value to our customer as a one-stop shop solution of health optimization.

[00:46:35] We know that also it will improve our retention of our members because they have greater connection to the club.

[00:46:43] And we also know that we're better utilizing another performance square footage of our space

[00:46:49] and driving another ancillary revenue stream of our clubs to continue to grow the enterprise.

[00:46:57] So when I look forward at our industry and if I had the power, right, which I don't think anybody does,

[00:47:04] to just rebrand the fitness industry, right, completely.

[00:47:08] And we'll put sports science, sports performance in its own category.

[00:47:11] But for the general population, if I was just going to rebrand it all, call fitness something different,

[00:47:16] I would call it longevity.

[00:47:18] And to me, what that means is like in the next 10, 15 years, you know, that just becomes the offering.

[00:47:25] It's like you walk into a gym or a health club or a lifetime and they're like, here's what we're going to do.

[00:47:31] And it's basically what you just lined out in Muir, right?

[00:47:34] Like that's the core offering.

[00:47:35] I mean, do you see a future like that?

[00:47:38] Is that kind of where you guys are hoping to take this?

[00:47:40] I do.

[00:47:41] I do.

[00:47:42] I think that, you know, it's what the consumer needs.

[00:47:47] It's what many of the educated and folks with discretionary income want now.

[00:47:55] When we launched this program, Eric, the demand was out of hand.

[00:48:01] It was more than our ability to meet and create supply.

[00:48:05] And that indicated to me that we really had something here, something that the consumer wanted and they understood very clearly.

[00:48:15] I surveyed 400,000 of our lifetime members as part of the research process of this undertaking before we launched it.

[00:48:23] 95% of them indicated that they were already engaged in some form of longevity or anti-aging and performance ranging from, you know, cold water immersion, cryo to red light to supplementation.

[00:48:41] And so they're already there.

[00:48:44] They just need to have the right platform and direction to tie it all together and do it right in a way that has the right impact.

[00:48:54] You know, I think what you're saying, because we're all hearing so much of it now, I call it health optimization, whether that's longevity.

[00:49:04] People want to live longer, better.

[00:49:07] And I think that's really important to understand this idea of health span versus lifespan.

[00:49:14] You know, I've said it so many times.

[00:49:16] The average American, you know, looks forward to the back nine, but 14 years of their life on average are spent in chronic poor health.

[00:49:26] You know, so how do they optimize their existing health?

[00:49:30] One of my CEOs of my previous company said it very simply, said, I want to go from this position to this position with nothing in between.

[00:49:39] And I think everybody gets that, right?

[00:49:43] And that's what I think clubs are positioned to do, to your point.

[00:49:49] I think they're so well positioned, but you're right.

[00:49:53] It hasn't been a very highly respected and regarded industry historically.

[00:49:58] It is growing up.

[00:50:00] It is maturing.

[00:50:01] Part of our problem as a public health company is the comps and the lack of great comps in the luxury resort part of the category.

[00:50:10] And that's held us back.

[00:50:12] And the financial community and the industry investors haven't really been able to understand the economic, powerful economic drivers of this business model.

[00:50:25] Yeah.

[00:50:26] Yeah, well said.

[00:50:27] And, you know, anecdotally, my wife and I just celebrated our birthdays are very close.

[00:50:32] We went to this place called Quinn's Hot Springs and it's outdoor hot springs and there's a cold plunge.

[00:50:36] And every time I went in the cold plunge, it was hysterical because what's the old CrossFit joke of like, well, how do you know if someone cold plunges?

[00:50:43] Don't worry, they'll tell you.

[00:50:43] Right.

[00:50:44] And everyone, like every single time I got in there is someone talking about human movement.

[00:50:47] Someone talking about like, and everyone had their own, like, well, the ultimate health benefits are this much time.

[00:50:53] And I'm like, this is hysterical.

[00:50:55] I love it.

[00:50:56] Everyone's super into it.

[00:50:57] Yeah, it was great.

[00:50:58] And you're seeing that just like we said, just go mainstream.

[00:51:01] And I really think it's important that with all the power of this happening in podcasts and other mediums is that the health club category becomes a mechanism for the consumer to activate.

[00:51:18] They need a resource to, you know, trust and respect.

[00:51:23] Last question for you, Jeff, and feel free to share as much as you can because it's personal.

[00:51:27] But what's kind of your personal health optimization longevity protocol?

[00:51:31] I appreciate it.

[00:51:33] Right.

[00:51:34] I've always tried to live a healthy life, as we call it, a healthy way of life at Lifetime.

[00:51:39] And walk the talk.

[00:51:42] As a former athlete, you know, I've been involved in a consistent resistance training program for 45 years.

[00:51:53] I didn't start lifting until my freshman year of college in 1980.

[00:51:58] But, you know, and, you know, I've run a significant number of marathons in 10Ks, did 100-mile mountain bike rides that we own in Leadville, Colorado, that go up to 13,000 feet.

[00:52:13] You have to finish them under 12 hours to get the infamous buckle.

[00:52:17] Hardest thing I've ever done in my life.

[00:52:19] And so I enjoy competition.

[00:52:22] I enjoy competing.

[00:52:24] I enjoy challenging myself.

[00:52:25] And I enjoy doing hard things.

[00:52:26] But a supplement regimen and eating well has always been the backbone of my life and lifestyle.

[00:52:35] But for me, daily routine is 15 to 20 minutes of a traditional sauna, three or four days a week of a cold plunge.

[00:52:47] I use a red light therapy periodically.

[00:52:51] As I said, you know, I'm using peptides like summer relin.

[00:52:57] I'm taking vitamin D's and magnesium and B vitamins and omega-3 fish oils.

[00:53:04] And, you know, in Minnesota, starting the extra doses of D now.

[00:53:11] But I'm probably not yet doing enough for, you know, the de-stressing and the mental part of just breaking away.

[00:53:23] That's my mountain biking and my road biking usually because it just requires you to be in the zone when you're in a single track.

[00:53:31] But trying to make sure that I continue to strive for more balance and that I round out my program more as I continue to learn more about the efficacy of so many of these different modalities and these different approaches to improving your overall health.

[00:53:51] And making sure I'm dealing with the mind and the body more than any of it.

[00:53:56] Because I've been too focused probably just on the body and grinding through the mental part of it.

[00:54:02] Yeah.

[00:54:03] Amazing.

[00:54:03] Jeff, thank you for sharing that.

[00:54:05] And if people want to get a hold of you or they want to reach out for any reason to collaborate or partner or do whatever, what's the best way?

[00:54:13] Yeah, the best way to reach me would be at, I've got a website.

[00:54:17] It's jzconsulting.com and they can also reach me by jeff.zwifel at gmail.com.

[00:54:26] Excellent.

[00:54:27] Excellent.

[00:54:28] Thank you.

[00:54:28] All right, Jeff.

[00:54:30] Yeah, this is a pleasure as always.

[00:54:32] And I'm sure I'll be seeing you around, but thank you for doing this.

[00:54:34] Ladies and gentlemen, Jeff Zwifel.

[00:54:36] Thank you, sir.

[00:54:38] Hey, wait, don't leave yet.

[00:54:39] This is your host, Eric Malzone, and I hope you enjoyed this episode of Future of Fitness.

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